Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

GlassOnion

Top 3 Indicators

Recommended Posts

If you could use only 3 indicators on your chart what would the be?

( and yes I am aware that some traders use no indicators ).

 

volume

color bars

20 ma

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Over 75% of my trade setups are based on three indicators:

 

Wavetrend, BullsEye and BullsEye Forecaster.

 

For me, these have help identify the most reliable and profitable of all my trades over the past three years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I will explain why I don't like math based indicators. It really boils down to they don't work. They don't give a trader any edge what so ever. When they do work they create more risk instead of less risk. Anyone who has ever tried to trade off of moving averages or some indicator that works off of them will know that they are not static. There is nothing better then having a signal at one point and then have it go away after the candle closes. MAs, stochastics, and MACDs are great for back testers. You can look back over the last 20 years and see all the money you would of made had you of just went off the indicators because its so clear. When you try to replicate that with real time on even a 5 min. chart you have situations where you get a signal and by the time the candle closes its gone away. If you trade this way you are forced to wait. This can also create another type of situation where price reaches the MA and the MA moves. This is all math based indicators and not just the few I mentioned.

 

You really have no edge with these indicators as well. They don't tell you when or where buyers or sellers may, can, or will step in. They don't in any way help you to limit the traders stop out. They can help you determine the direction of the market but a 10 year old can do that. They for sure don't help a person to understand why or how a market works. Can you make money with them? Yea sure maybe. But don't quit your day job. They simply are not a stand alone way to trade.

 

The math based indicator argument is really broken and divided into two groups. One group that believes similar to me. And the other group swears by them. Since so far I haven't heard a compelling argument to resolve the obvious flaws. This is really a bad thing because this suggests that the traders that swear by them I doubt are making money and are only looking at them in the past or in back testing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I will explain why I don't like math based indicators. It really boils down to they don't work. They don't give a trader any edge what so ever. When they do work they create more risk instead of less risk. Anyone who has ever tried to trade off of moving averages or some indicator that works off of them will know that they are not static. There is nothing better then having a signal at one point and then have it go away after the candle closes. MAs, stochastics, and MACDs are great for back testers. You can look back over the last 20 years and see all the money you would of made had you of just went off the indicators because its so clear. When you try to replicate that with real time on even a 5 min. chart you have situations where you get a signal and by the time the candle closes its gone away. If you trade this way you are forced to wait. This can also create another type of situation where price reaches the MA and the MA moves. This is all math based indicators and not just the few I mentioned.

 

You really have no edge with these indicators as well. They don't tell you when or where buyers or sellers may, can, or will step in. They don't in any way help you to limit the traders stop out. They can help you determine the direction of the market but a 10 year old can do that. They for sure don't help a person to understand why or how a market works. Can you make money with them? Yea sure maybe. But don't quit your day job. They simply are not a stand alone way to trade.

 

The math based indicator argument is really broken and divided into two groups. One group that believes similar to me. And the other group swears by them. Since so far I haven't heard a compelling argument to resolve the obvious flaws. This is really a bad thing because this suggests that the traders that swear by them I doubt are making money and are only looking at them in the past or in back testing.

 

So, what works for you? Please explain in detail.

 

Also, to categorize indicators which can disappear after the bar closes is being "closed minded" in my opinion. Only a fraction of indicators paint during the formation of bar, and of course the good ones paint only after a candle has closed. I believe this is essential as to not change the OHLC. Most repainting indicators would disappear! But, you are correct for those indicators that paint intra-bar, and thus become repainting indicators... they are near worthless.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I will explain why I don't like math based indicators. It really boils down to they don't work. They don't give a trader any edge what so ever. When they do work they create more risk instead of less risk. Anyone who has ever tried to trade off of moving averages or some indicator that works off of them will know that they are not static. There is nothing better then having a signal at one point and then have it go away after the candle closes. MAs, stochastics, and MACDs are great for back testers. You can look back over the last 20 years and see all the money you would of made had you of just went off the indicators because its so clear. When you try to replicate that with real time on even a 5 min. chart you have situations where you get a signal and by the time the candle closes its gone away. If you trade this way you are forced to wait. This can also create another type of situation where price reaches the MA and the MA moves. This is all math based indicators and not just the few I mentioned.

 

You really have no edge with these indicators as well. They don't tell you when or where buyers or sellers may, can, or will step in. They don't in any way help you to limit the traders stop out. They can help you determine the direction of the market but a 10 year old can do that. They for sure don't help a person to understand why or how a market works. Can you make money with them? Yea sure maybe. But don't quit your day job. They simply are not a stand alone way to trade.

 

The math based indicator argument is really broken and divided into two groups. One group that believes similar to me. And the other group swears by them. Since so far I haven't heard a compelling argument to resolve the obvious flaws. This is really a bad thing because this suggests that the traders that swear by them I doubt are making money and are only looking at them in the past or in back testing.

 

When I first started out, the first thing I "discovered" was MA's and MACD. I was convinced I found the holy grail to making money and wondered why everyone in the world wasn't using this indicator. Next day I discovered it's not what I thought; the indicator comes out too "late" and it seems it's good to use for backtesting only. I guess some do use it to trade. Didn't work for me though!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I will explain why I don't like math based indicators. It really boils down to they don't work. ...

 

there is a difference between "they don't work" and "I don't know how to use them".

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yes that is true. I should of clarified. I have not had much success with them. Its quite possible that I wasn't shown or taught how to use them correctly. But while I am clarifying I forgot to mention Fibs. I don't believe in them as well for the same reasons. And that could vary well be that I don't know where to Fib from. But so far I find it hard to find accurate information that trades real time and has decent rules to follow that uses exclusively just math based indicators. In back testing this stuff works awesome and its amazing. The problem is that I haven't found a broker that will allow me to place a trade into a position that happens 10+ minutes ago. Usually the retail market eats this up because of the back testing aspect. I am still hard pressed to find some one who is making decent money that watches 1 market in 3-5 different time frames with all math based indicators. The folks I know that make decent money watch 3-5 markets on 0-1 time frame and don't use any math based indicators.

 

Again this is just me and my experience and I still hold to the fact that they give you no edge as far as where buyer/seller can, may, and will step in. But hey if you are making money contrary to what I said doesn't work then by all means you think of me when you are sitting on the beach drinking drinks out of those pineapple things. At least you will get a laugh out of it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Yes that is true. I should of clarified. I have not had much success with them. Its quite possible that I wasn't shown or taught how to use them correctly. But while I am clarifying I forgot to mention Fibs. I don't believe in them as well for the same reasons. And that could vary well be that I don't know where to Fib from. But so far I find it hard to find accurate information that trades real time and has decent rules to follow that uses exclusively just math based indicators. In back testing this stuff works awesome and its amazing. The problem is that I haven't found a broker that will allow me to place a trade into a position that happens 10+ minutes ago. Usually the retail market eats this up because of the back testing aspect. I am still hard pressed to find some one who is making decent money that watches 1 market in 3-5 different time frames with all math based indicators. The folks I know that make decent money watch 3-5 markets on 0-1 time frame and don't use any math based indicators.

 

Again this is just me and my experience and I still hold to the fact that they give you no edge as far as where buyer/seller can, may, and will step in. But hey if you are making money contrary to what I said doesn't work then by all means you think of me when you are sitting on the beach drinking drinks out of those pineapple things. At least you will get a laugh out of it.

 

The market is generous and indiscriminent; it beams out signals of its intentions to everybody around the world. Some can see the signals in tapes, some can see signals in price action, some can see the signals in math-based indicators, some can see signals in fibs, some can see signals in voodoo. Use whatever you can to meet your purpose. Most people talk about things that work for them. You have chose to talk about things that don't work for you. It shows that deep inside you, you believe that they should work, but you are angry (or disappointed?) that you have not found a way to profit from them.

 

I can tell you truthfully right now, so that I do not set up the wrong expectation: off the surface, I mean on the surface, without drilling too deep into any complicated multi-indicator analysis, I can tell you most of the "indicators" works 50% of the time. 50% is not a bad statistics, just ask any baseball player and they will tell you that you can be a millionaire and die and go to heaven for a point 500 average.

 

I noticed in your previous post you mention a 5 min chart... my suggestion is to take a step back, look at the big picture, then develop a strategy to tackle the intraday challenges. Since you are such a nice guy, I am going to give you an illustration... it is already posted here on TL.

http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/trading-markets/13963-show-us-your-chart.html

 

take a look at post #2... take a look at the turning points. This is an EOD daily chart. ie. there is no rush for any decisions, you have the whole night to digest the chart and think about the possibilities before the market opens again in the morning.

 

I am picking this example because you have mentioned those indicators in a previous post. You can decide, base on your observation and your analysis, if these wavy lines are of any value to you. (some might not see what I see even if I use a thousand arrows and hundred rainbow colors to highlight the key areas).

 

If you see what I see, you might ask: is this repeatable before and beyond the scope of this chart? can I use this on other instruments? what guarantees do you have? I would say, they are fair questions. I would ask the same if I were presented with such a chart. I would also look deeper, to see if those indicators and those vertical lines are the only deciding factors. But for now, I would question myself, why do I see this in hindsight, but not in real time? After all, we have more than 8 hours after the publish of those charts to read and think and analyze and to debate before we have to decide if the market is going up or down. And those charts and indicators are freely available to everybody around the world; there is no subscription, no fees, no black box, no esoteric riddles... everything is out in the open. So where is the problem? is it me? or is it the indicator?

 

Reading the market is easy... just don't argue with it and it will give you the message.

 

Good luck.

Edited by Tams

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
This is an EOD daily chart. ie. there is no rush for any decisions, you have the whole night to digest the chart and think about the possibilities before the market opens again in the morning.

 

Hi Tams,

 

In every single instance on this chart the stock had gapped to give you a worse price buying on the next day's open. If you're using EOD closing price, would it not be better to enter on the close?

 

And if you don't want the overnight exposure, why not just trade with opening price data?

 

BlueHorseshoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Originally Posted by Tams »

This is an EOD daily chart. ie. there is no rush for any decisions, you have the whole night to digest the chart and think about the possibilities before the market opens again in the morning.

Hi Tams,

 

In every single instance on this chart the stock had gapped to give you a worse price buying on the next day's open. If you're using EOD closing price, would it not be better to enter on the close?

 

And if you don't want the overnight exposure, why not just trade with opening price data?

 

BlueHorseshoe

 

Hope this answers your question:

 

...

I noticed in your previous post you mention a 5 min chart...

my suggestion is to take a step back, look at the big picture,

then develop a strategy to tackle the intraday challenges.

...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Well, sort of . . . The close of day is at the end of 5 minutes though, isn't it?

 

But I do see that you're trying to respond to what someone else asked.

 

BlueHorseshoe

 

if you are daytrading, you don't hold overnight.

if you are daytrading, where the market opens is irrelevant. You are only concerned with what is happening during the day.

 

if you are swing trading, look at the future potential...

forget about the pennies you have left behind.

enter on signal, but never jump the gun.

 

Yes, you can enter on close (or anytime you like)... my post is an illustration, not a trading instruction.

each trader has a different account size, risk tolerance, and expectation. If you see the prospect, go for it.

Edited by Tams

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm lost here. Can someone please explain how these recent posts are relative, contribute to the discussion of top three indicators, and answer the question of the OP?

 

Seems like this thread, which could have been evolved well with the discussion of how people view and use indicators, has turned into a private conversation.

 

:crap:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm lost here. Can someone please explain how these recent posts are relative, contribute to the discussion of top three indicators, and answer the question of the OP?

 

Seems like this thread, which could have been evolved well with the discussion of how people view and use indicators, has turned into a private conversation.

 

:crap:

 

You must be new to the public forum media. :helloooo:

 

Let's see how many "Like" you will get for your post.

Edited by Tams

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Seems like this thread, which could have been evolved well with the discussion of how people view and use indicators, has turned into a private conversation.

 

Starting with Tams response in post #14, the discussion has become one of the best I've read on a trading forum. Tam's responses are thoughtful, intelligent, well-written, and in my opinion 100% correct.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I'm lost here. Can someone please explain how these recent posts are relative, contribute to the discussion of top three indicators, and answer the question of the OP?

 

Seems like this thread, which could have been evolved well with the discussion of how people view and use indicators, has turned into a private conversation.

 

:crap:

 

Very sorry for not contributing in the exact way that you would like me to, SMMatrix.

 

Here, is this better?

 

  1. Simple Moving Average
  2. Donchian Channel
  3. GRAB Index*

 

That's obviously a much more informative and on-topic post, and I'm sure everyone will have learnt a lot from it.

 

Regards,

 

BlueHorseshoe

 

* The GRAB (Goldfish Revolutions Around Bowl) Index was the result of my attempts to incorporate aquatically-backpropogated non-artificial neural networks into my trading. Basically, I generated a Pavlovian response by only feeding the goldfish following a significant price change. Their tank now sits opposite my screens, and every time a big move is about to unfold the fish sense this and increase the rate at which they swim around their bowl. This has worked very well for me, except during the flash-crash, when the fish swam so fast that they churned their water to boiling point. Apparently RenTech were developing a similar idea but with wolf-cubs, but abandoned the experiment because the combined costs of commission, slippage, and wolf-feed were too high . . .

Edited by BlueHorseshoe

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Very sorry for not contributing in the exact way that you would like me to, SMMatrix.

 

Here, is this better?

 

  1. Simple Moving Average
  2. Donchian Channel
  3. GRAB Index*

 

* The GRAB (Goldfish Revolutions Around Bowl) Index was the result of my attempts to incorporate aquatically-backpropogated non-artificial neural networks into my trading. Basically, I generated a Pavlovian response by only feeding the goldfish following a significant price change. Their tank now sits opposite my screens, and every time a big move is about to unfold the fish sense this and increase the rate at which they swim around their bowl. This has worked very well for me, except during the flash-crash, when the fish swam so fast that they churned their water to boiling point. Apparently RenTech were developing a similar idea but with wolf-cubs, but abandoned the experiment because the combined costs of commission, slippage, and wolf-feed were too high . . .

 

No problem my trading brother. Interesting concept with the goldfish indicator. Do you have backtested results which you can share?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Date: 11th July 2025.   Demand For Gold Rises As Trump Announces Tariffs!   Gold prices rose significantly throughout the week as investors took advantage of the 2.50% lower entry level. Investors also return to the safe-haven asset as the US trade policy continues to escalate. As a result, investors are taking a more dovish tone. The ‘risk-off’ appetite is also something which can be seen within the stock market. The NASDAQ on Thursday took a 0.90% dive within only 30 minutes.   Trade Tensions Escalate President Trump has been teasing with new tariffs throughout the week. However, the tariffs were confirmed on Thursday. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports starting August 1st, along with 50% tariffs on copper and goods from Brazil. Some experts are advising that Brazil has been specifically targeted due to its association with the BRICS.   However, the President has not directly associated the tariffs with BRICS yet. According to President Trump, Brazil is targeting US technology companies and carrying out a ‘witch hunt’against former Brazilian President Jair Bolsonaro, a close ally who is currently facing prosecution for allegedly attempting to overturn the 2022 Brazilian election.   Although Brazil is one of the largest and fastest-growing economies in the Americas, it is not the main concern for investors. Investors are more concerned about Tariffs on Canada. The White House said it will impose a 35% tariff on Canadian imports, effective August 1st, raised from the earlier 25% rate. This covers most goods, with exceptions under USMCA and exemptions for Canadian companies producing within the US.   It is also vital for investors to note that Canada is among the US;’s top 3 trading partners. The increase was justified by Trump citing issues like the trade deficit, Canada’s handling of fentanyl trafficking, and perceived unfair trade practices.   The President is also threatening new measures against the EU. These moves caused US and European stock futures to fall nearly 1%, while the Dollar rose and commodity prices saw small gains. However, the main benefactor was Silver and Gold, which are the two best-performing metals of the day.   How Will The Fed Impact Gold? The FOMC indicated that the number of members warming up to the idea of interest rate cuts is increasing. If the Fed takes a dovish tone, the price of Gold may further rise. In the meantime, the President pushing for a 3% rate cut sparked talk of a more dovish Fed nominee next year and raised worries about future inflation.   Meanwhile, jobless claims dropped for the fourth straight week, coming in better than expected and supporting the view that the labour market remains strong after last week’s solid payroll report. Markets still expect two rate cuts this year, but rate futures show most investors see no change at the next Fed meeting. Gold is expected to finish the week mostly flat.       Gold 15-Minute Chart     If the price of Gold increases above $3,337.50, buy signals are likely to materialise again. However, the price is currently retracing, meaning traders are likely to wait for regained momentum before entering further buy trades. According to HSBC, they expect an average price of $3,215 in 2025 (up from $3,015) and $3,125 in 2026, with projections showing a volatile range between $3,100 and $3,600   Key Takeaway Points: Gold Rises on Safe-Haven Demand. Gold gained as investors reacted to rising trade tensions and market volatility. Canada Tariffs Spark Concern. A 35% tariff on Canadian imports drew attention due to Canada’s key trade role. Fed Dovish Shift Supports Gold. Growing expectations of rate cuts and Trump’s push for a 3% cut boosted the gold outlook. Gold Eyes Breakout Above $3,337.5. Price is consolidating; a move above $3,337.50 could trigger new buy signals. Always trade with strict risk management. Your capital is the single most important aspect of your trading business.   Please note that times displayed based on local time zone and are from time of writing this report.   Click HERE to access the full HFM Economic calendar.   Want to learn to trade and analyse the markets? Join our webinars and get analysis and trading ideas combined with better understanding of how markets work. Click HERE to register for FREE!   Click HERE to READ more Market news.   Michalis Efthymiou HFMarkets   Disclaimer: This material is provided as a general marketing communication for information purposes only and does not constitute an independent investment research. Nothing in this communication contains, or should be considered as containing, an investment advice or an investment recommendation or a solicitation for the purpose of buying or selling of any financial instrument. All information provided is gathered from reputable sources and any information containing an indication of past performance is not a guarantee or reliable indicator of future performance. Users acknowledge that any investment in Leveraged Products is characterized by a certain degree of uncertainty and that any investment of this nature involves a high level of risk for which the users are solely responsible and liable. We assume no liability for any loss arising from any investment made based on the information provided in this communication. This communication must not be reproduced or further distributed without our prior written permission.
    • Back in the early 2000s, Netflix mailed DVDs to subscribers.   It wasn’t sexy—but it was smart. No late fees. No driving to Blockbuster.   People subscribed because they were lazy. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone else is lazy too.   Those who saw the future in that red envelope? They could’ve caught a 10,000%+ move.   Another story…   Back in the mid-2000s, Amazon launched Prime.   It wasn’t flashy—but it was fast.   Free two-day shipping. No minimums. No hassle.   People subscribed because they were impatient. Investors bought the stock because they realized everyone hates waiting.   Those who saw the future in that speedy little yellow button? They could’ve caught another 10,000%+ move.   Finally…   Back in 2011, Bitcoin was trading under $10.   It wasn’t regulated—but it worked.   No bank. No middleman. Just wallet to wallet.   People used it to send money. Investors bought it because they saw the potential.   Those who saw something glimmering in that strange orange coin? They could’ve caught a 100,000%+ move.   The people who made those calls weren’t fortune tellers. They just noticed something simple before others did.   A better way. A quiet shift. A small edge. An asymmetric bet.   The red envelope fixed late fees. The yellow button fixed waiting. The orange coin gave billions a choice.   Of course, these types of gains are rare. And they happen only once in a blue moon. That’s exactly why it’s important to notice when the conditions start to look familiar.   Not after the move. Not once it's on CNBC. But in the quiet build-up— before the surface breaks.   Enter the Blue Button Please read more here: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/netflix-amazon-bitcoin-blue  Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • What These Attacks Look Like There are several ways you could get hacked. And the threats compound by the day.   Here’s a quick rundown:   Phishing: Fake emails from your “bank.” Click the link, give your password—game over.   Ransomware: Malware that locks your files and demands crypto. Pay up, or it’s gone.   DDoS: Overwhelm a website with traffic until it crashes. Like 10,000 bots blocking the door. Often used by nations.   Man-in-the-Middle: Hackers intercept your messages on public WiFi and read or change them.   Social Engineering: Hackers pose as IT or drop infected USB drives labeled “Payroll.”   You don’t need to be “important” to be a target.   You just need to be online.   What You Can Do (Without Buying a Bunker) You don’t have to be tech-savvy.   You just need to stop being low-hanging fruit.   Here’s how:   Use a YubiKey (physical passkey device) or Authenticator app – Ditch text message 2FA. SIM swaps are real. Hackers often have people on the inside at telecom companies.   Use a password manager (with Yubikey) – One unique password per account. Stop using your dog’s name.   Update your devices – Those annoying updates patch real security holes. Use them.   Back up your files – If ransomware hits, you don’t want your important documents held hostage.   Avoid public WiFi for sensitive stuff – Or use a VPN.   Think before you click – Emails that feel “urgent” are often fake. Go to the websites manually for confirmation.   Consider Starlink in case the internet goes down – I think it’s time for me to make the leap. Don’t Panic. Prepare. (Then Invest.)   I spent an hour in that basement bar reading about cyberattacks—and watching real-world systems fall apart like dominos.   The internet going down used to be an inconvenience. Now, it’s a warning.   Cyberwar isn’t coming. It’s here.   And the next time your internet goes out, it might not just be your router.   Don’t panic. Prepare.   And maybe keep a backup plan in your back pocket. Like a local basement bar with good bourbon—and working WiFi.   As usual, we’re on the lookout for more opportunities in cybersecurity. Stay tuned.   Author: Chris Campbell (AltucherConfidential) Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/   
    • DUMBSHELL:  re the automation of corruption ---  200,000 "Science Papers" in academic journal database PubMed may have been AI-generated with errors, hallucinations and false sourcing 
    • Does any crypto exchanges get banned in your country? How's about other as Bybit, Kraken, MEXC, OKX?
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.