I'm New and Somewhat Lost

[tradingwolves 10]

I'm new and somewhat lost, on ways to know when to get into a trade and if i should buy or sell, and what i should be looking at. i do have a demo account, i thought that would be the best way to start out and not lose a great deal of money right off the bat.

[RealDemo 10]

Here are some links to get yourself a little bit less lost, hope it helps:

 

 

Learning Center

 

Forex Training Online: Learn Foreign Exchange (FX) Currency Trading

 

Forex Money Management

 

Try to be methodical and disciplined in your education right from the start. It can sometimes be at this time that the novice trader is prone to picking up bad habits that can be difficult to undo later on.

 

This is a good reference as well: http://www.investopedia.com/university/#axzz1f7EM8NYK

[henryduncan12 10]

At initial stage, you should go for demo account. It will help to avoid real money loss as well as assist to learn more and more about forex trading.

[tradingwolves 10]

thanks for the feed back... i have been reading and i see a lot of things about signals of what i can get out of it is that referring to the candle stick? The candle stick i'm lost, i heard this off of fxcm.com in one of there training via there online training. what do you use is there better ones out there then the candle stick?

[John Bradford 10]

I wouldn't jump into Forex at the beginning. I would trade stock first, then options, then forex, and only go to the next step when I was comfortable and profitable.

 

Candle stick refers to a method of drawing stock charts. Go to finance.yahoo.com and pick a stock and click on Basic Tech Analysis in the left hand column. You'll see a selection where you can pick how you want to draw the chart... Line : Bar : Candle. Select candle and you can see what it looks like. There are advantages to looking at a stock chart in candles over line or bar charts. Do a google on stock market candles or something like that to see what candles are all about.

 

So I think the steps for you are:

1. Read Rule #1 by Phil Town and The Little Book that Beats the Market by Joel Greenblatt. That will give you the basics of Fundamental analysis.

2. Pick 5 companies that you want to follow and read the news on them at least weekly. You can get more than enough info at finance.yahoo.com

3. Spend an afternoon at the library reading books on Fundamental Analysis and Technical Analysis.

 

It's a long road; there's no shortcut.

 

John

[cfrn 10]

Have you decided what markets you want to trade?

Equities

Emini Futures

Metals

Agriculture

 

It's a big list and it can all be a bit overwhelming. I suggest finding one thing and then sit with it for a while. You're in a good place and there are many on this forum who can help you with your journey. Take it slow. Keep your money in your pocket.

 

Read "Trading in the Zone" by Mark Douglas.

 

Find a mentor. That's easier said than done but keep asking questions and you'll find somebody you click with.

 

Most of all........ exercise patience.

 

Trading's not easy - but it can be simple.

 

Best Wishes!

[fadenscales 10]

The one thing that changed the outlook on my trading and improved my understanding of the market more than anything was Market Profile and then Volume Profile trading. I went from a trader obsessed with indicators to a consistently profitable trader when I started to understand market auction theory and how to start analyzing what the market had done, what it was trying to do and how well it was doing it. It may be a little more advanced than you are ready for, but as soon as you have a grasp of the basic process of trading I highly recommend reading more into market and volume profiling and working it into your trading. It can work in any market, although I have seen better success within highly liquid markets such as the ES, FESX, DAX, 6E. There are some excellent posts on this site relating to market profile from beginner explanations, to advanced reading of the charts and related strategies. Wish you the best and if you have any questions relating to this topic feel free to PM me.

 

Tom

Fade 'n' Scales

[zdo 20]

tradingwolves,

 

Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown and start trading LIVE!!!! In this LIVE, forward testing mode, explore methods, instruments, timeframes, platforms rapidly and playfully – like you’re a freakin’ Percival with ADHD (and ADD too). When you find sets of those that are true to your nature then, and only then, mature out of grail search mode and train intensively on sim in 2 to 4 per day 90 minute max length sessions for at least 3 weeks. In training, focus as much on training your mind and body as you do on ‘understanding’ and ‘mastering’ your methods, instruments, timeframes, platforms … in things like getting back in the correct ‘state’ as efficiently as possible – whether the last trades were winners or losers, etc. And when you go back live expect / be ready to be confronted by some unforeseen challenges. Summons the courage to “get up in your own face…”, to ask and answer questions that can’t be answered ‘analytically’, to carry the tension of the discrepancies btwn the trading you do and the trading you know you can do… and also learn how to really care for and take care of yourself... In performance work, we are always either in prehab or we are in rehab!

”The essence is the idea of learning to be comfortable being uncomfortable and having something to go to when the garbage hits the fan, because the garbage will hit the fan and let's be ready for it” ... the theories of Ken Ravizza, a professor of Kinesiology and author of several books on sports psychology.Mental Preparation in Baseball and Trading

 

 

all the best,

 

zdo

[MightyMouse 12]

Wow! Sound like a tourist who has seen poker on TV and then wanders over to the poker room in a casino buys chips and asks the other players what a flush is or a straight or trips, etc. Stay away from the live markets for a very long time.

 

But, if you have to, then try trading CL and let me know when you are trading.

[zdo 20]

Wow! Sound like a tourist who has seen poker on TV and then wanders over to the poker room in a casino buys chips and asks the other players what a flush is or a straight or trips, etc.

Provided the tourist really sets up “Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown” – that is precisely the most rewarding way to learn poker.

 

But, if you have to, then try trading CL ...

If the beginning trader sets up “Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown” then CL is a wonderful place to start... However, for most traders starting out, the Capitalize part will rule out the accelerated path to trading excellence CL can deliver.

 

I'm railing on the typical and what I believe is misguided utilization of sim!

[zdo 20]

re Post 8 above.

That was such bad advice. Please forgive me. Let me correct myself. Dally and dither, fk around on and off sim for a year or two, put less than zero real pressure on yourself, use someone else’s methods exclusively ie don’t dare develop anything on your own. Even better, try to find some g-ru in an e-room who knows exactly what you need to do. After all that sim screen time then go live and blow up 2 or 3 accounts, spend more time in misery each day than anyone on this planet but for the truly evil ppl should… then quit for a while. In your time away from the action, never question your own neurology’s role, etc. in your performance… just study the markets and methods and edges… and sim sim and sim some more

Then, of cource, get more and more and more “disciplined” … now you’re getting it! Just be mentally disciplined… Start trading again and then slow kill another one or two more accounts…and maybe fast kill one more… and 3 years later fkn quit again… wait a few months and start again, this time with even more horrible unsolicited stories and memories flying back up out of your myofascia into your head everytime you sit down and open up your tradestation…

then finally, if you’re persisting, you start dealing with stuff you should have been dealing with from day one in the way you should have dealt with it from day one instead of all the fake sim sht…

It only took 5 years to discover what you could have discovered in 6 months.

 

… What was I thinking? Clearly this more typical story is preferable to what I proposed in post 8. Again…Everyone please forgive me…

[zdo 20]

… and please forgive me for challenging industry paradigms and truisms, especially about sim’s effects. Please forgive me for ever saying DON’T TRY TO TRANSFER AND APPLY OR RELY ON EDUCATION’S (especially the collectivistic slant from current western gov’t school learning models and yes I am keyboard screaming.) ‘NORMAL’ TENETS

Please forgive me for questioning the wisdom of loosely applying the principles of great video gamer play to trading, when it's clearly in "everyone" else's head that way now…

Please forgive me for ever saying

Pre 2000, learning by paper trading was inefficient at best and most likely helped create LoooozER!!!!!!

Post 2000, learning by sim trading is inefficient at best and most likely produces LoooozER!!!!!!.

[zdo 20]

tradingwolves, Post 8 is advice for the few.

Everyone else is giving you the ‘good’ advice.

I’m giving you the ‘bad’ advice.

 

Go poll any 100 traders, only a tiny % of them will say Stay Real, No Sim.

This settles it for most noobs – sim is the way to go.

Then consider that among any 100 traders, only a tiny % of them really thrive. Also consider that if a trader does sim and then makes it out of the loozer pareto, s/he made it because of other factors. The weight of the sim-ming as a factor in the ultimate success in miniscule… even though there will be ardent posters trying to talk some sense into me and save you…and even though there will also be exceptions too – traders for whom simming really was the “way”. But, statistically speaking, it is a major part of the ‘big trap’ for beginners.

 

Implementing line one of post 8 is one of the most immediately accessible ways to differentiate your self from the herd. I have been involved with quite a few traders at their beginnings. So far, every one of them could have benefited from this way - if only to accelerate the time they needed to find out if and how trading was really for them.

 

The advantages to the first way are

1You find out faster if trading really is for you or not. You find out how much fire in your belly you have for it and if you don’t, you can move on to the next ‘game’ / opportunity / challenge.

2 You learn fast. You get to both the implicit and explicit learning much quicker. Probably most important part of this is you learn fast how to take real losses… and many of them… and how to recover from real losses and develop superb inner ways of dealing with them. If one carefully sets up and follows the parameters of the first line of post 8, the work and play and learning has the benefits of sim PLUS THE GEOMETRIC GAINS FROM REAL /LIVE/ NOT SIM learning (yes I’m finger screaming again!)

3 You concentrate your pain, instead of spreading it out across much, much longer time.

4. When you get to the proper and limited stage where simming is appropriate – you can structure and concentrate on serious training, not faking and flitting about, etc.

 

I know none of this probably makes sense and it's awful dang contrary...

Find out for yourself... just giving you an alternative to sim / school swimming with the other noobs

[xkr1962 10]

Learning to trade is about conditioning your brain, IMHO it cannot be rushed.

 

I have been helping fellow traders for years now and some still say they learn new stuff about my method even after all that time. If you find someone to help you be prepared to give it years not months to sink in.

 

Once you find a method you like, if it is set and forget, i.e you enter the trade, fix a stop and a have a fixed target then learn to trade that method like a machine, do it on a demo account that mirrors the size of your eventual live account. I suggest 2 or 3K.

 

When you can double that demo account with fewer and fewer mistakes then consider moving to live. This may take six months or three years only you will know when you stop taking trades outside of your strict rules, you will know when you are ready.

 

I did this and transition from demo to live was painless.

Edited December 3, 2011 by xkr1962

[MightyMouse 12]

Provided the tourist really sets up “Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown” – that is precisely the most rewarding way to learn poker.

 

 

If the beginning trader sets up “Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown” then CL is a wonderful place to start... However, for most traders starting out, the Capitalize part will rule out the accelerated path to trading excellence CL can deliver.

 

I'm railing on the typical and what I believe is misguided utilization of sim!

 

I simply would like new traders to practice live when and where I am trading. Every little bit helps.

[xkr1962 10]

I simply would like new traders to practice live when and where I am trading. Every little bit helps.

 

Haha, I like it, very good.

[b4gt 10]

I am linking here 2 different methods that you can get started

 

Forex e-Books | Forex4Noobs

 

Learn Forex Live Members Area - 3SMA system

 

Read them, understand them and then look in the charts where you see price behaving the way these resources describe. Don't mind the indicators mentioned in the second link. You only need the moving averages, the rest you should be noticing with a naked eye, it is what will come with experience and chart time.

 

After you have done your homework try to apply these methods in your demo account. You will only trade only the signals from these methods when there is no signal, there will be no trade. This way you will learn discipline to follow a method.

 

After a year, if you demo account is alive and green, you can go live with these methods and maybe you can use your demo to experiment with other methods.

 

As for candlesticks etc you should definitely go through the school of pipsology Forex Training Online: Learn Foreign Exchange (FX) Currency Trading

 

(BTW I am in no way affiliated with any of the providers for the links. I am pasting just to satisfy my ego for helping a fellow noob. )

[Tradewinds 12]

I'm new and somewhat lost, on ways to know when to get into a trade and if i should buy or sell, and what i should be looking at. i do have a demo account, i thought that would be the best way to start out and not lose a great deal of money right off the bat.

 

Accept and prioritize:

 

• ACCEPT: It will take years to become a good and competent trader.
  
• ACCEPT: You need money, and the discipline to manage your personal finances for a long time before you become profitable.
  
• ACCEPT: Unless you give trading a huge part of your life, and are dedicated to it, I don't know that you can succeed.
  
• PRIORITIZE: What can you afford to give in time and money to trading, and what do you need to give to everything else?
  

 

Unless you get the above things right, talking about what market to trade or what method to use might turn out to be a futile effort.

 

You can spends months or years pursuing any of the many trading methods, only to find out that you don't believe in it. Try to get quick exposure to as many types of trading methods and theories as you can, then compare and contrast them, and assess your personal ability to utilize them. What I'm saying is, don't become obsessed with one thing to the point where you are not learning anything new. Always be asking whether the trading method has an explanation for what moves the price, and does it make sense to you.

[Tams 20]

I'm new and somewhat lost, on ways to know when to get into a trade and if i should buy or sell, and what i should be looking at. i do have a demo account, i thought that would be the best way to start out and not lose a great deal of money right off the bat.

 

Remember this one simple rule to profitable trading...

write it down on a piece of paper,

write it on top of your monitor,

write it out a hundred times every morning before the market opens,

write it on top of your keyboard,

write it on the bathroom mirror,

write it on your coffee mug,

 

 

Never argue with the market

[SpearPointTrader 10]

So, I have read through this whole thread. I have to say, the poster who recommends live trading right away, is hoping to be on the other side of the transaction. It's a sure way to get wiped out fast. It's a set up for failure.

 

I am currently investigating the course from Facts Trading.

 

It's a pretty hokey layout, but has some incredible advice for the beginner.

 

For starters, it recommends a minimum of 9 months of paper trading. It goes on to say one should learn to hand chart first, before ever trying to paper trade with the computer. The author feels hand charting is a learning tool that better etches the material into your brain.

 

Next it teaches how to search for potentially profitable setups using only the price itself, before even beginning to teach the most basic indicators. It's not restricted to any one market. The set up is the key. It does not matter what market that set up appears in. They all get traded the same way.

 

Lastly it recommends NOT trading for real, until you can win at least 80% of the time. It's a high percentage day trading system designed for people with small accounts who cannot afford to lose much. It seeks to keep wins greater than losses, and to also win more often than lose.

 

It's been my experience that trading is very tough, and has a whole bunch of psychological issues tied to it. One really needs to master the mechanics of their system inside and out, in real time simulated trading, before trading for real. Otherwise you have to deal with the learning curve AND all the psychological stuff that comes with trading real money as well.

 

Although the above course is well worth it's pricey cost, and I have really learned a lot from it, I have also found a small e-book that has a couple of spectacular, simple trades that a beginner can use to start the learning and paper trading process. The third trade strategy especially is worth millions in the right hands alone. It looks like a super simplified Turtle trade to me.

 

Amazon.com: FOUR SIMPLE FUTURES TRADES THAT WORK! eBook: Nick Monticello: Kindle Store

 

Speaking of Turtle trading, I highly recommend the book by Russel Sands on Turtle Trading. In the late 1970s, the founder of that method took $1300.00 and turned it into 200 million over the course of his career. The book tells most of how he did it.

 

An examination of WD Gann's basic stuff is also recommended. There is a Yahoo Groups page set up for the study of his various methods. Search for it.

 

John Bollinger, on Bollinger Bands is also a must read.

 

Start by learning the basics, like how to form trend lines, support and resistance lines, figure replacement levels, and spot the major charting formations.

 

Again, that .99 e-book is worth it's weight in gold. If you already know how to read a chart, and place your orders and Stop-Loss orders and stuff, that is a winning system all to itself. Even if you don't have a Kindle reader, you can just download the reader software for free and read the book on any windows machine (That is what I did).

 

Last, and again, don't listen to anyone who tells you to try and learn by actually putting money in the markets. Losing 100 straight trades is not going to teach you anything, but how to be a loser. Learn to win first, THEN risk real money.

Edited December 4, 2011 by SpearPointTrader

[SpearPointTrader 10]

Accept and prioritize:

 

• ACCEPT: It will take years to become a good and competent trader.
  
• ACCEPT: You need money, and the discipline to manage your personal finances for a long time before you become profitable.
  
• ACCEPT: Unless you give trading a huge part of your life, and are dedicated to it, I don't know that you can succeed.
  
• PRIORITIZE: What can you afford to give in time and money to trading, and what do you need to give to everything else?
  

 

Unless you get the above things right, talking about what market to trade or what method to use might turn out to be a futile effort.

 

You can spends months or years pursuing any of the many trading methods, only to find out that you don't believe in it. Try to get quick exposure to as many types of trading methods and theories as you can, then compare and contrast them, and assess your personal ability to utilize them. What I'm saying is, don't become obsessed with one thing to the point where you are not learning anything new. Always be asking whether the trading method has an explanation for what moves the price, and does it make sense to you.

 

I can agree with your list, however, not all methods work on fundamental reasons for price movement. Many methods just follow strong direction, regardless of any underlying reason.

[SpearPointTrader 10]

tradingwolves,

 

Capitalize and (or) De-leverage and (or) PositionSize to the point that your account can accommodate 100 losing trades in a row and it would still be only in a 40% drawdown and start trading LIVE!!!! In this LIVE, forward testing mode, explore methods, instruments, timeframes, platforms rapidly and playfully – like you’re a freakin’ Percival with ADHD (and ADD too). When you find sets of those that are true to your nature then, and only then, mature out of grail search mode and train intensively on sim in 2 to 4 per day 90 minute max length sessions for at least 3 weeks. In training, focus as much on training your mind and body as you do on ‘understanding’ and ‘mastering’ your methods, instruments, timeframes, platforms … in things like getting back in the correct ‘state’ as efficiently as possible – whether the last trades were winners or losers, etc. And when you go back live expect / be ready to be confronted by some unforeseen challenges. Summons the courage to “get up in your own face…”, to ask and answer questions that can’t be answered ‘analytically’, to carry the tension of the discrepancies btwn the trading you do and the trading you know you can do… and also learn how to really care for and take care of yourself... In performance work, we are always either in prehab or we are in rehab!

”The essence is the idea of learning to be comfortable being uncomfortable and having something to go to when the garbage hits the fan, because the garbage will hit the fan and let's be ready for it” ... the theories of Ken Ravizza, a professor of Kinesiology and author of several books on sports psychology.Mental Preparation in Baseball and Trading

 

 

all the best,

 

zdo

 

Kinesiology and sports psychology, have nothing to do with learning to trade. If anything, the only physical discipline that may relate to trading would be Tai Chi, because of it's Taoist core fundamentals (Taoists are lazy, they go with the flow IE follow the trend)

 

What you recommend above is a recipe for sheer disaster. It's the same mentality that has people jumping off the roofs of buildings.

[cfrn 10]

I can only imagine how much "More Lost" he now feels.

 

Jim's Crickets Guys.

 

Seriously?

[SpearPointTrader 10]

I can only imagine how much "More Lost" he now feels.

 

Jim's Crickets Guys.

 

Seriously?

 

What? :shrug:

 

 

 

.................

[tradingwolves 10]

wow!!!! that is a lot. i have started to going through it, it is going to take some time to get through it all... there is apart of me that is more lost than before.