Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

Enigmatics

A Few Questions About Trading the Trendlines

Recommended Posts

I've recently been trying to tighten up my ability to draw the right trend lines, horizontal lines, and identifying trade channels.

 

Do you guys have any specific pointers that could help? Furthermore, how reliable are trend lines on smaller time intervals like a 2min?

 

I was having a bit of success pairing 2min charts with 5min and trading breaks on ETF's of prior resistance levels. I've suddenly hit a brick wall. I have been a little too focused on 2min (kind of ignoring the 5min) and trying to attack every horizontal resistance level I marked with very little distinction. Suffice to say I've suddenly been very unsuccessful. I feel like my little run with scalping 8-10 ticks was fool's gold.

 

The reason I bring up the issue with the horizontal resistances is that I rarely (if ever) have bought the dip and I want to be able to with confidence instead of constantly relying on breaking of resistances. This becomes harder and harder to do if the volume dries up as the trading day moves on and the algos run amuck.

Edited by Enigmatics

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  clmacdougall said:
How are you drawing your trendlines now? Please explain how you construct your trendlines and then maybe others can help.

 

Sure thing. I'm always up early for pre-market. I trade a lot of SPXU and FAS. I make sure to mark a horizontal line for every resistance or support they make. Here are two examples on a 2min chart of the trading channels I missed today. For the trend lines I look for two common points in a straight line of the channel on the top and on the bottom. Drawing them afterwards it feels like it was a no-brainer so I don't know what I was thinking at as they took place.

 

Again I've marked these where I felt like I missed the obvious, but maybe there's more to it.

 

SPXU

27thsk.png

 

FAS (EDIT: I wrote SHORT ON SUPPORT, but I meant SHORT ON RESISTANCE)

bunlyg.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Enigmatics said:
Sure thing. I'm always up early for pre-market. I trade a lot of SPXU and FAS. I make sure to mark a horizontal line for every resistance or support they make. Here are two examples on a 2min chart of the trading channels I missed today. For the trend lines I look for two common points in a straight line of the channel on the top and on the bottom. Drawing them afterwards it feels like it was a no-brainer so I don't know what I was thinking at as they took place.

 

Again I've marked these where I felt like I missed the obvious, but maybe there's more to it.

 

SPXU

27thsk.png

 

FAS (EDIT: I wrote SHORT ON SUPPORT, but I meant SHORT ON RESISTANCE)

bunlyg.png

 

those lines are draw in hindsight... not much use in real time trading.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Tams said:
those lines are draw in hindsight... not much use in real time trading.

 

That's precisely why I'm asking. So do you not use them at all? I just want to find a way to get more comfortable buying dips. I figured better trendlines would help me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Enigmatics said:
Sure thing. I'm always up early for pre-market. I trade a lot of SPXU and FAS. I make sure to mark a horizontal line for every resistance or support they make. Here are two examples on a 2min chart of the trading channels I missed today. For the trend lines I look for two common points in a straight line of the channel on the top and on the bottom. Drawing them afterwards it feels like it was a no-brainer so I don't know what I was thinking at as they took place.

 

Again I've marked these where I felt like I missed the obvious, but maybe there's more to it.

 

SPXU

27thsk.png

 

FAS (EDIT: I wrote SHORT ON SUPPORT, but I meant SHORT ON RESISTANCE)

bunlyg.png

 

Hi Enigmatics,

 

Could I clear up one thing before we go ahead. Are you confused about trendlines or channels. They are two totally seperate things and I'm not sure we're on the same page when you mention the placement of your trendlines'.

 

You have shown pics of channels and what you consider support and resistance lines but none of trendlines . Please include how you incorporate a trendline in this scenario. I wonder if part of the problem is that you are using your channels as trendlines.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Enigmatics said:
I've recently been trying to tighten up my ability to draw the right trend lines, horizontal lines, and identifying trade channels.

 

Do you guys have any specific pointers that could help? Furthermore, how reliable are trend lines on smaller time intervals like a 2min?

 

I was having a bit of success pairing 2min charts with 5min and trading breaks on ETF's of prior resistance levels. I've suddenly hit a brick wall. I have been a little too focused on 2min (kind of ignoring the 5min) and trying to attack every horizontal resistance level I marked with very little distinction. Suffice to say I've suddenly been very unsuccessful. I feel like my little run with scalping 8-10 ticks was fool's gold.

 

The reason I bring up the issue with the horizontal resistances is that I rarely (if ever) have bought the dip and I want to be able to with confidence instead of constantly relying on breaking of resistances. This becomes harder and harder to do if the volume dries up as the trading day moves on and the algos run amuck.

 

 

Hi Enigmatics,

 

I use the Metatrader 4 platform to trade ForEx and I have great experiences using Tom DeMark Trend lines. DeMark uses the two most recent (Fractal) Highs and Lows to draw them. Next to that there are some "qualifiers" that tell you whether a trend line break is valid for trading or not.

 

If you Google "Tom DeMark Trendlines" there is plenty to learn about it. Here's a PDF to read some more on the subject.

 

Happy Trading!

 

Cheers,

 

Peter a.k.a. Dutchie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Dutchie said:
Hi Enigmatics,

 

I use the Metatrader 4 platform to trade ForEx and I have great experiences using Tom DeMark Trend lines. DeMark uses the two most recent (Fractal) Highs and Lows to draw them. Next to that there are some "qualifiers" that tell you whether a trend line break is valid for trading or not.

 

If you Google "Tom DeMark Trendlines" there is plenty to learn about it. Here's a PDF to read some more on the subject.

 

Happy Trading!

 

Cheers,

 

Peter a.k.a. Dutchie

 

I absolutely love TD Lines, please tell me how extensively you use them and for how long you've found them to be successful? I have studied them in depth and found them to be great trading tools as the last part of your decision making process after you have decided which side of the market to be on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  clmacdougall said:
I absolutely love TD Lines, please tell me how extensively you use them and for how long you've found them to be successful? I have studied them in depth and found them to be great trading tools as the last part of your decision making process after you have decided which side of the market to be on.

 

Hi,

 

I always use them, together with my (customized) DTosc, which is a combination of Stoch./RSI. When using proper money management (duhh), they are VERY useful!

IMHO they tend to work better on the 60 min timeframe or higher. There are several TD Trendline indicators circulating the trading forums but I prefer the ones with the qualifiers although they're easy to memorize. If you are familiar with trading differently shaped triangles (my absolute favorite pattern) it's easy to set your profit targets too.

 

Happy Trading!

 

Cheers,

 

Peter

Edited by Dutchie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Dutchie said:
Here's a PDF to read some more on the subject.

 

  • Trendline drawing can be very subjective - 10 people, 10 different trendlines
  • Rules may be inconsistent.
  • Need validation that trendline is correct
  • Continue at trend break, or reverse? That's the question.
  • Draw trendlines from Right to Left. Insures using the latest data.
  • 4 different qualifiers to decide what to do.
  • Something about a bar's "TRUE" high or low. Rules, but I don't know what the logic is.
  • 3 Rules for abandoning the trade: Rules apply to the bar after the entry bar.
  • Next bar opens below breakout level - Abandon trade (Long)
  • Next bar opens below the previous close and closes down - Abandon trade (Long)
  • Fails to make higher high - Abandon trade (Long)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Tradewinds said:
  • Trendline drawing can be very subjective - 10 people, 10 different trendlines
  • Rules may be inconsistent.
  • Need validation that trendline is correct
  • Continue at trend break, or reverse? That's the question.
  • Draw trendlines from Right to Left. Insures using the latest data.
  • 4 different qualifiers to decide what to do.
  • Something about a bar's "TRUE" high or low. Rules, but I don't know what the logic is.
  • 3 Rules for abandoning the trade: Rules apply to the bar after the entry bar.
  • Next bar opens below breakout level - Abandon trade (Long)
  • Next bar opens below the previous close and closes down - Abandon trade (Long)
  • Fails to make higher high - Abandon trade (Long)

 

DeMark trendlines AND their qualifiers are NOT subjective if one can read: "If any of the four qualifiers are true, the trendline break is valid" which leave all your other remarks pointless.....

Edited by Dutchie

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
  Dutchie said:
DeMark trendlines AND their qualifiers are NOT subjective if one can read: "If any of the four qualifiers are true, the trendline break is valid" which leave all your other remarks pointless.....

 

I wasn't stating that DeMark trendlines are subjective. The bullet points were taken directly from the PDF file. The PDF file stated that a problem with many trendlines is that they are subjective. That statement was made to contrast the objectively of the DeMark trendlines. Again, what I wrote was just a rewording of what is stated in the PDF file. I wasn't criticizing the DeMark method of trendlines.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I studied Drummond Geometry for a couple of years and his method of drawing lines is different from the mainstream. His approach draws lines using only 2 bars in order to forecast S/R for the 3rd bar. I found some other combinations in my own work that I also included in an indicator. Unlike anything that is out there my indicator prints a # above and below the bar showing how many tics the high or low is from the termination point of the TL for the current bar. If you are using your method on a 5min chart and you want confirmation that you have hit a S/R level you can apply my indicator to a higher timeframe like a 30min to see how many tics you are from a current TL. The amount of tics away from a TL that would be a heads up will vary from market to market. I have only ever traded the Russell so all I can attest to would be that anything 5 and under would be a warning that a turn is evident. I have included an Eld file (I hope I did it right ) for the indicator.You guys can have it for free.

PI TL #.ELDFetching info...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

One confirmation that you could use to get into the trend is say we're at support. Whichever time frame you are using, wait for a break of the high of the low bar before entering long. The same holds true for shorts, wait for a break of the low of the high bar.

 

So if the ES is in a downtrend and rallies off lows, you can just wait for a break below the low of the highest bar on the way up. This also allows for a definitive stop to be placed above the high of that high bar.

 

Just my two cents on a little added entry signal.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • Thx for reminding us... I don't bang that drum often enough anymore Another part for consideration is who that money initially went to...
    • TDUP ThredUp stock, watch for a top of range breakout above 2.94 at https://stockconsultant.com/?TDUP
    • How long does it take to receive HFM's withdrawal via Skrill? less than 24H?
    • My wife Robin just wanted some groceries.   Simple enough.   She parked the car for fifteen minutes, and returned to find a huge scratch on the side.   Someone keyed her car.   To be clear, this isn’t just any car.   It’s a Cybertruck—Elon Musk's stainless-steel spaceship on wheels. She bought it back in 2021, before Musk became everyone's favorite villain or savior.   Someone saw it parked in a grocery lot and felt compelled to carve their hatred directly into the metal.   That's what happens when you stand out.   Nobody keys a beige minivan.   When you're polarizing, you're impossible to ignore. But the irony is: the more attention something has, the harder it is to find the truth about it.   What’s Elon Musk really thinking? What are his plans? What will happen with DOGE? Is he deserving of all of this adoration and hate? Hard to say.   Ideas work the same way.   Take tariffs, for example.   Tariffs have become the Cybertrucks of economic policy. People either love them or hate them. Even if they don’t understand what they are and how they work. (Most don’t.)   That’s why, in my latest podcast (link below), I wanted to explore the “in-between” truth about tariffs.   And like Cybertrucks, I guess my thoughts on tariffs are polarizing.   Greg Gutfield mentioned me on Fox News. Harvard professors hate me now. (I wonder if they also key Cybertrucks?)   But before I show you what I think about tariffs… I have to mention something.   We’re Headed to Austin, Texas This weekend, my team and I are headed to Austin. By now, you should probably know why.   Yes, SXSW is happening. But my team and I are doing something I think is even better.   We’re putting on a FREE event on “Tech’s Turning Point.”   AI, quantum, biotech, crypto, and more—it’s all on the table.   Just now, we posted a special webpage with the agenda.   Click here to check it out and add it to your calendar.   The Truth About Tariffs People love to panic about tariffs causing inflation.   They wave around the ghost of the Smoot-Hawley Tariff from the Great Depression like it’s Exhibit A proving tariffs equal economic collapse.   But let me pop this myth:   Tariffs don’t cause inflation. And no, I'm not crazy (despite what angry professors from Harvard or Stanford might tweet at me).   Here's the deal.   Inflation isn’t when just a couple of things become pricier. It’s when your entire shopping basket—eggs, shirts, Netflix subscriptions, bananas, everything—starts costing more because your money’s worth less.   Inflation means your dollars aren’t stretching as far as they used to.   Take the 1800s.   For nearly a century, 97% of America’s revenue came from tariffs. Income tax? Didn’t exist. And guess what inflation was? Basically zero. Maybe 1% a year.   The economy was booming, and tariffs funded nearly everything. So, why do people suddenly think tariffs cause inflation today?   Tariffs are taxes on imports, yes, but prices are set by supply and demand—not tariffs.   Let me give you a simple example.   Imagine fancy potato chips from Canada cost $10, and a 20% tariff pushes that to $12. Everyone panics—prices rose! Inflation!   Nope.   If I only have $100 to spend and the price of my favorite chips goes up, I either stop buying chips or I buy, say, fewer newspapers.   If everyone stops buying newspapers because they’re overspending on chips, newspapers lower their prices or go out of business.   Overall spending stays the same, and inflation doesn’t budge.   Three quick scenarios:   We buy pricier chips, but fewer other things: Inflation unchanged. Manufacturers shift to the U.S. to avoid tariffs: Inflation unchanged (and more jobs here). We stop buying fancy chips: Prices drop again. Inflation? Still unchanged. The only thing that actually causes inflation is printing money.   Between 2020 and 2022 alone, 40% of all money ever created in history appeared overnight.   That’s why inflation shot up afterward—not because of tariffs.   Back to tariffs today.   Still No Inflation Unlike the infamous Smoot-Hawley blanket tariff (imagine Oprah handing out tariffs: "You get a tariff, and you get a tariff!"), today's tariffs are strategic.   Trump slapped tariffs on chips from Taiwan because we shouldn’t rely on a single foreign supplier for vital tech components—especially if that supplier might get invaded.   Now Taiwan Semiconductor is investing $100 billion in American manufacturing.   Strategic win, no inflation.   Then there’s Canada and Mexico—our friendly neighbors with weirdly huge tariffs on things like milk and butter (299% tariff on butter—really, Canada?).   Trump’s not blanketing everything with tariffs; he’s pressuring trade partners to lower theirs.   If they do, everybody wins. If they don’t, well, then we have a strategic trade chess game—but still no inflation.   In short, tariffs are about strategy, security, and fairness—not inflation.   Yes, blanket tariffs from the Great Depression era were dumb. Obviously. Today's targeted tariffs? Smart.   Listen to the whole podcast to hear why I think this.   And by the way, if you see a Cybertruck, don’t key it. Robin doesn’t care about your politics; she just likes her weird truck.   Maybe read a good book, relax, and leave cars alone.   (And yes, nobody keys Volkswagens, even though they were basically created by Hitler. Strange world we live in.) Source: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/the-truth-about-tariffs-busting-the-inflation-myth    Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/       
    • No, not if you are comparing apples to apples. What we call “poor” is obviously a pretty high bar but if you’re talking about like a total homeless shambling skexie in like San Fran then, no. The U.S.A. in not particularly kind to you. It is not an abuse so much as it is a sad relatively minor consequence of our optimism and industriousness.   What you consider rich changes with circumstances obviously. If you are genuinely poor in the U.S.A., you experience a quirky hodgepodge of unhelpful and/or abstract extreme lavishnesses while also being alienated from your social support network. It’s about the same as being a refugee. For a fraction of the ‘kindness’ available to you in non bio-available form, you could have simply stayed closer to your people and been MUCH better off.   It’s just a quirk of how we run the place and our values; we are more worried about interfering with people’s liberty and natural inclination to do for themselves than we are about no bums left behind. It is a slightly hurtful position and we know it; we are just scared to death of socialism cancer and we’re willing to put our money where our mouth is.   So, if you’re a bum; you got 5G, the ER will spend like $1,000,000 on you over a hangnail but then kick you out as soon as you’re “stabilized”, the logistics are surpremely efficient, you have total unchecked freedom of speech, real-estate, motels, and jobs are all natural healthy markets in perfect competition, you got compulsory three ‘R’’s, your military owns the sky, sea, space, night, information-space, and has the best hairdos, you can fill out paper and get all the stuff up to and including a Ph.D. Pretty much everything a very generous, eager, flawless go-getter with five minutes to spare would think you might need.   It’s worse. Our whole society is competitive and we do NOT value or make any kumbaya exception. The last kumbaya types we had werr the Shakers and they literally went extinct. Pueblo peoples are still around but they kind of don’t count since they were here before us. So basically, if you’re poor in the U.S.A., you are automatically a loser and a deadbeat too. You will be treated as such by anybody not specifically either paid to deal with you or shysters selling bejesus, Amway, and drugs. Plus, it ain’t safe out there. Not everybody uses muhfreedoms to lift their truck, people be thugging and bums are very vulnerable here. The history of a large mobile workforce means nobody has a village to go home to. Source: https://askdaddy.quora.com/Are-the-poor-people-in-the-United-States-the-richest-poor-people-in-the-world-6   Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.