Trader P/L 2010

[edabreu 10]

Smoking day today... caught a tiny bit of it.

[method 10]

Put on a short on the DAX before US open but it reached my stop loss before crashing :crap::crap: The high was 7 ticks above my stop.

 

Ended up with a $30 loss.

 

I usually only trade once per day and they are usually overnight positions.

 

 

Just to illustrate....The black is where I shorted, the blue lines were my stops.

 

 

 

Hope the day went better for some of you :P

[enochbenjamin 10]

Was down 980 at one point so to end the day with a loss of 125 was a victory for the day.

 

[thalestrader 14]

Was down 980 at one point so to end the day with a loss of 125 was a victory for the day.

 

Sounds like a real slugfest ... way to fight your back! When I have days like that I usually find myself down 980 early in the day, and if I don't stop, I end the day down 9800. I usually stop. Usually.

 

Best Wishes,

 

Thales

[subterfuge 10]

+$60 or so

 

Annoying. This day should have been very profitable and finished early. 2 of my signals triggered and hit their targets very quickly. Clockwork. However, I missed them both for various reasons. Bit annoyed after that but manged to eek out a tick or 2 to get me ever so slightly green for the day.

 

Would be nice to be able to program so that i could automate a strategy and actually get a propper backtest done to give me some confidence (or not!) without having to do it manually whenever i get some spare time.

 

Thalestrader: I know that you trade manually, but have you been able to ever run a backtest of your method? Or do you believe that you method is too discretionary to do such a thing? I ve been thinking a bit recently about all this. I guess people who can program have a certain advantage and will waste less time on fruitless ideas and get necessary confidence quicker due to the ability to backtest/automate?

[enochbenjamin 10]

To frustrated to click a screenshot.

 

-300 today after being down $2200. It seems I get disciplined only after taking a big loss. I need to work on that...

[JEHs 10]

Trading for the week

[method 10]

Going against the trend + overtrading = not good!

 

[enochbenjamin 10]

Going against the trend + overtrading = not good!

 

well i always go against the trend, but i feel ya on the overtrading part! Took 45 trades in oil today - mostly because i was behind and was trying to erase my loss.

 

i have actually gone back and looked at my best days - rarely do i do more than 10 - 12 trades. On losing days I always seem to be in the 20 - 30 range. hmmmm.....

[method 10]

Actually I usually am contrarian as well but coupled with overtrading it can lead to bad results. The thing is, I was unsure of putting on the trades because the market didn't look like it had reached a temporary bottom but I did it anyway because of fear of leaving money on the table.

 

Do you scalp?

[enochbenjamin 10]

 

Do you scalp?

 

Most of the time. When I scalp and I know I am scalping I can pull 8 - 10¢ out of oil with regularity. My problems occur when I enter a trade as a counter trend scalp and decide it can be a swing trade. Then I widen my stop and usually get burned. The trade I made to make up my losses was a single trade that netted 2k, however that is not what I am comfortable with. My identity when I am on is to be a bricklayer and come to the market everyday and take advantage of the bearish nature of commodities.

 

Just typing this lets me see the error of my ways, so thanks for allowing me to have this cathartic experience.

[brownsfan019 17]

I've heard this many times and am realizing it more now, that many trading methods are good in a trending or a choppy market but not both. This leads me to think you have to do one of the following:

1. find a way to determine what each day is going to be before trading and then use the matching method (not sure anyone has a good way to predict if the days action will be trending or nontrending)

2. find a method of trading that works in both

3. trade your method on both types of days but try to set rules to limit losses on a day that is not ideal for your method

4. give up and play the lotto

 

That is more than you asked but I had a few more things on my mind.

 

1: Very difficult to know in advance, based on past movements, whether a trending or non-trending day is going to show up tomorrow IMO. Let's scratch this option.

 

2: Trending day - play breakouts, moving average pullbacks. Non-Trending - play candle reversals @ bollinger bands. It's that easy IF you know which one to use that day. Let's scratch this option as well.

 

3: This is my preferred choice of the 4. Why? B/c I don't think #1 is possible to do w/ consistency and in order to do #2 I think you need #1 so by default if nothing else, we are on to option #3.

 

4: Tempting, but I think you'll get better odds heading to Vegas and having a hell of a time at the craps tables.

 

So option #3 appears to be the best choice at this point. So the key Dinero is simple (yet hard) - knowing when to shut your system down for the day and when to keep it running.

 

As Thales said - you may want to refine your entries as well using some sort of filter to keep you out of as many bad trades as possible. The L, LL, HL method, the 2B method, using some volatility bands/indicators, whatever.

[bathrobe 10]

3: This is my preferred choice of the 4. Why? B/c I don't think #1 is possible to do w/ consistency and in order to do #2 I think you need #1 so by default if nothing else, we are on to option #3.

 

This sounds like the best way to trade to me and is what I do.

 

Intraday what looks like a trending day can quickly turn into something else all together. The market can chop all morning and then trend all afternoon also. My advise would be to have a setup that works for you most of the time and when you spot this take advantage of it.

 

In the time I have traded I have come across countless setups, I cant look for all of these during the day, I look for the ones that are mostly profitable for me, if I looked for them all I would have conflicting views all day and would be hedging a lot. Not to mention commission would be through the roof.

Edited January 25, 2010 by bathrobe

[brownsfan019 17]

New year update -- I will try to get my p/l up from last week and caught up later today but I wanted to just put a little post up that might help Dinero (and any others in the same situation of having this huge basket to trade from and feeling like you are thinned out) - the last week or so I've just been focusing on the CL to trade. The moves and profit potential is unmatched for me and my trading, so all effort is now being directed there. I have a CL chart up with 3 different timeframes and that's it. I'm still looking for the setups that I prefer the most, but using 3 different (albeit close) timeframes to get into trades. The CL is just providing too many opportunities that I can miss staring at other charts at this point in time. I have no idea how long it will continue like this, but for now, I'm just trading the CL.

[Dinerotrader 10]

So option #3 appears to be the best choice at this point. So the key Dinero is simple (yet hard) - knowing when to shut your system down for the day and when to keep it running.

 

All my trades are based around S/R levels so here are the rules I am considering implementing for regulating when to shut'er down. I am also only looking to trade reversals as I don't feel competent enough to trade breakouts yet.

 

1. Only 2 entries are allowed at each S/R level to catch a move. After 2 tries, only watching is allowed. (my stops are normally ~5 ticks away from entry so 2 stop outs would be ~10 ticks on oil or natural gas)

2. Stop trading all together for the day if I have been stopped out 4 times in a row or if a closed trade makes my loss greater than $200.

 

Let me know if these make any sense or if you have found a more logical basis for these types of rules.

[brownsfan019 17]

All my trades are based around S/R levels so here are the rules I am considering implementing for regulating when to shut'er down. I am also only looking to trade reversals as I don't feel competent enough to trade breakouts yet.

 

1. Only 2 entries are allowed at each S/R level to catch a move. After 2 tries, only watching is allowed. (my stops are normally ~5 ticks away from entry so 2 stop outs would be ~10 ticks on oil or natural gas)

2. Stop trading all together for the day if I have been stopped out 4 times in a row or if a closed trade makes my loss greater than $200.

 

Let me know if these make any sense or if you have found a more logical basis for these types of rules.

 

1: Sounds good if the entry method is refined enough for you to be able to say that 2 shots is enough.

 

2: If you are planning to trade the CL and stop when your day loss reaches $200 = 20 ticks. Depends on your entry and stop loss as to whether or not that makes sense.

[brownsfan019 17]

1-21-10: +$1730

 

1-25-10: +$1860

 

Some nice trading the CL here lately. You'll notice that today's screenshot includes a ninjatrader recap as I was doing some testing with it today. Good idea to have more than 1 broker account open should something happen to your main one.

[enochbenjamin 10]

Only down $500 today before getting my discipline. By the end of the week maybe I'll be back to starting the day with discipline. Waaaaaaay too many trades to get the 487 I wound up with. Gotta get this shit together.

 

[brownsfan019 17]

Only down $500 today before getting my discipline. By the end of the week maybe I'll be back to starting the day with discipline. Waaaaaaay too many trades to get the 487 I wound up with. Gotta get this shit together.

 

 

Is that 30 individual trades or is that cumulative and trading multiple contracts? If that's the # of trades being done, that's a lot IMO. I'm shooting for around 5 per day to give you an idea. Not saying it's bad, just is quite a bit of trading.

[enochbenjamin 10]

Is that 30 individual trades or is that cumulative and trading multiple contracts? If that's the # of trades being done, that's a lot IMO. I'm shooting for around 5 per day to give you an idea. Not saying it's bad, just is quite a bit of trading.

 

Its individual trades. Don't be nice - you can rip me. I know its idiotic. My best days are never more than 10 trades. I have been overtrading because I have been starting each day down so much. I am a counter trend trader and if I am not patient and dont follow my setups to the "T" I lose. I did very well in dec. and was overly anxious to start the new year. I am still profitable but just DONATING too much to the broker.

[brownsfan019 17]

Its individual trades. Don't be nice - you can rip me. I know its idiotic. My best days are never more than 10 trades. I have been overtrading because I have been starting each day down so much. I am a counter trend trader and if I am not patient and dont follow my setups to the "T" I lose. I did very well in dec. and was overly anxious to start the new year. I am still profitable but just DONATING too much to the broker.

 

I think that's a ton of trading in 1 day, esp when you consider that oil is open 9am-230pm basically. The good news is that you did get back on the day, the bad news is that it took quite a bit to get there. And today was a day where it did give you a chance to get back as there wasn't a clear, one way direction trend to fight. My biggest concern would be what if it was a straight shot, look out below trend and you kept fighting it over and over? Could you come back the next day and fight again?

 

It's good that you are aware that you do not like trading this much and want to do something about it. That's a big deal as many would ignore it.

 

Keep using this thread to keep you on track and if you know you want to be at 10 trades or under, make that the goal!

[enochbenjamin 10]

Thanks for the encouraging comments.

[bathrobe 10]

Well, my first day trading a smaller account and I seemed to have forgotten all my rules and traded like a complete novice. Not to mention watching two perfect oil trades go by and 2 es trades. I am quitting early today to regroup and refocus. I may spend the entire afternoon jogging so I will have no trouble getting a good nights sleep. At least I ended the day up.

[thalestrader 14]

... the last week or so I've just been focusing on the CL to trade. The moves and profit potential is unmatched for me and my trading, so all effort is now being directed there. ... for now, I'm just trading the CL.

 

Brownie, what have you started?! I read your post the other day, and thought I'd check out the action on crude. I have since decided that when my daughter starts trading her futures account this coming summer, she will trade currencies and crude, not the ES.

 

I've been doing some demo trades myself. Like I said to Dinero in another thread a few weeks ago, Crude is a very well-behaved market right now.

 

So here is my demo blotter - repeat, demo - I did not trade these with live money. Currencies and stocks are enough for me to handle. I'm treating crude as a sort of video game to play with. What liked the best is that my average trade time was 21 minutes. Anything I can make book on with such limited exposure gets my attention.

 

Best Wishes,

 

Thales

[Dinerotrader 10]

Brownie, what have you started?! I read your post the other day, and thought I'd check out the action on crude. I have since decided that when my daughter starts trading her futures account this coming summer, she will trade currencies and crude, not the ES.

 

I've been doing some demo trades myself. Like I said to Dinero in another thread a few weeks ago, Crude is a very well-behaved market right now.

 

So here is my demo blotter - repeat, demo - I did not trade these with live money. Currencies and stocks are enough for me to handle. I'm treating crude as a sort of video game to play with. What liked the best is that my average trade time was 21 minutes. Anything I can make book on with such limited exposure gets my attention.

 

Best Wishes,

 

Thales

 

Welcome to the oil family Thales. It seems like before BF started posting about oil I never really heard much discussion about it on the forum but it seems to have seduced many. Of course, you are no stranger to crude. I know you posted about having very long term positions on oil as it came down from its highs.