The Price / Volume Relationship

[Gregor_S 10]

This is my chart for Friday.

[cnms2 10]

This is a monthly DJI chart....

The price also climbed up to the RTL of the bull market with its pt3 in early 03 ...

[cnms2 10]

My view of Friday...

It's interesting to notice that your blue up channel's pt2 black volume is a little smaller than its pt3 red volume.

[ehorn 10]

It's interesting to notice that your blue up channel's pt2 black volume is a little smaller than its pt3 red volume.

 

Yes... This alternate view is similar to Gregor_S's.

[sscott 10]

My chart for today, one trade, 11 points. I just held all day.

[innersky 10]

My chart for today, one trade, 11 points. I just held all day.

 

At 15:25 (the pennant) looked to me as a signal for change (the lateral has ended on the previous bar and we're back into the up trend) as it gets broken on the downside on increasing red.

What did I miss here? Why isn't this a signal for change?

 

--

thanks,

 

innersky

[ehorn 10]

At 15:25 (the pennant) looked to me as a signal for change (the lateral has ended on the previous bar and we're back into the up trend) as it gets broken on the downside on increasing red.

What did I miss here? Why isn't this a signal for change?

 

--

thanks,

 

innersky

 

FWIW, I observe the following:

 

The lateral was dominant and volume gives increasingly higher peaks into the entry (i.e. no spike). The pennant was formed by decreasing volume. Pennant BO's typically create Increasing volume. The first bar was Pennant FBO on IRV followed by BO on DRV (Jokari?), followed by IRV with decreased volatility.

 

P.S. Nice trade sscott...

[cnms2 10]

At 15:25 (the pennant) looked to me as a signal for change (the lateral has ended on the previous bar and we're back into the up trend) as it gets broken on the downside on increasing red.

What did I miss here? Why isn't this a signal for change?

 

--

thanks,

 

innersky

Fractal? Context? ...

[Ezzy 10]

At 15:25 (the pennant) looked to me as a signal for change (the lateral has ended on the previous bar and we're back into the up trend) as it gets broken on the downside on increasing red.

What did I miss here? Why isn't this a signal for change?

 

--

thanks,

 

innersky

 

FWIW, from my point of view, there was a short term change there. Tape up to then, tape down to 15:40, and up to 10:35 today to finish an up traverse.

 

FWIW, I observe the following:

 

The lateral was dominant and volume gives increasingly higher peaks into the entry (i.e. no spike). The pennant was formed by decreasing volume. Pennant BO's typically create Increasing volume. The first bar was Pennant FBO on IRV followed by BO on DRV (Jokari?), followed by IRV with decreased volatility.

 

P.S. Nice trade sscott...

 

@ ehorn, can I assume the peaks you were talking about are at 14:25, 14:40 and 14:50?

 

@ cnms2, there hasn't been much discussion here on peak and trough analysis, except for your post noting peaks some time back. What have been your observations regarding them?

[cnms2 10]

... @ cnms2, there hasn't been much discussion here on peak and trough analysis, except for your post noting peaks some time back. What have been your observations regarding them?

Not sure what you're asking ... Volume bars, peaks, peaks of peaks, through their absolute and relative levels define moves on all fractals. They help you stay on your fractal of choice. Although a skilled trader can probably trade almost whatever observable fractal he wants on any chart, for any given chart resolution there's an optimum tradable fractal that I believe to be the traverse level, or L2.

[rs5 10]

Tuesday 10 November 2009

[rs5 10]

My chart for today, one trade, 11 points. I just held all day.

 

Very Nice!......................

[Ezzy 10]

Not sure what you're asking ... Volume bars, peaks, peaks of peaks, through their absolute and relative levels define moves on all fractals. They help you stay on your fractal of choice. Although a skilled trader can probably trade almost whatever observable fractal he wants on any chart, for any given chart resolution there's an optimum tradable fractal that I believe to be the traverse level, or L2.

 

For example, generally you have rising peaks in the dominant direction and declining troughs in the non-dom direction. Though you have to take into consideration the typical midday declining volume pattern.

 

But on the ehorns blue traverse you mentioned a pt3 had a slightly higher volume peak than the pt2. A pt3 is typically a volume trough, and I would be looking at the peaks post pt3 to compare to a pt2 peak. Comparing dominant to dominant. This should apply to all fractals. So I would assume you were comparing the lower level fractal peaks at the end of those legs (of ehorn's blue up goat). And using those to suggest the non-dom 2 to 3 originally annotated might have been a dominant leg.

 

So short version, wanted some clarification rather than going on assumption on what you meant, and why. And do you have a differing view or other insights to add on reading the volume peaks and troughs?

 

Regards - EZ

[cnms2 10]

For example, generally you have rising peaks in the dominant direction and declining troughs in the non-dom direction. Though you have to take into consideration the typical midday declining volume pattern.

 

But on the ehorns blue traverse you mentioned a pt3 had a slightly higher volume peak than the pt2. A pt3 is typically a volume trough, and I would be looking at the peaks post pt3 to compare to a pt2 peak. Comparing dominant to dominant. This should apply to all fractals. So I would assume you were comparing the lower level fractal peaks at the end of those legs (of ehorn's blue up goat). And using those to suggest the non-dom 2 to 3 originally annotated might have been a dominant leg.

 

So short version, wanted some clarification rather than going on assumption on what you meant, and why. And do you have a differing view or other insights to add on reading the volume peaks and troughs?

 

Regards - EZ

Firstly: I believe that the only source to learn this stuff from is directly from Spydertrader's words (posted and spoken). Somebody else's interpretation may help, but it's more likely that it will introduce something inconsequential or even incorrect. Having said this, I also believe that sharing personal points of view, when taken at their face value can be useful. Occasionally people become defensive, sometimes delusional, but overall Spydertrader's forums proved to be of the highest quality.

 

Secondly: it is again my opinion that although all the information posted by Spydertrader and by Jack is of the highest value, to benefit from it the student have to carefully look at it both in the historical context it was posted, as well as at his own level of understanding of the method. Not all the aha's we have are real aha's that will stand the test of time ... and market. There are some nuances, even differences, between how Jack and how Spydertrader seem to trade. There is also different emphasis on certain elements of the systems presented in this forum and elsewhere. I believe that almost exclusively relying on what Spydertrader posted in this forum is a complete and profitable system.

 

Now, trying to quickly reply to your question: looking at ehorn's and rs5's charts from that day, I thought that both came to about the same conclusion on a fractal, but differed how they went to the next higher fractal. To me, it looked that ehorn's blue up goat wasn't probable because its pt2 and pt3 didn't fit the volume.

 

I believe that faster fractals show as volume formations having smaller amplitude, absolute and / or relative to slower fractals. The actual volume we see results from the superposition of all existing fractals.

 

In that particular case, it looked that we had a complete retrace down, and the resumption of the up dominant move at the end of the day (that itself is a retrace of the next higher fractal move). The blue up goat suggested, in my view, otherwise. If memory serves me well, that day was a down retrace, and the up move in the middle of the day was a retrace in that down retrace.

 

When considering the relative volumes of the pt1, bo, 2, 3, ftt, we should keep in mind that on different fractals a through might correspond to a peak. Still, it seems that always the picture, when correctly analyzed, is correct for each fractal observable on every chart. Obviously the typical pace throughout the day has to be factored into our analysis.

[Gregor_S 10]

These are my charts for the last two days.

[rs5 10]

Wednesday 11 November 2009

Edited November 12, 2009 by rs5

[Gregor_S 10]

My chart for Wednesday.

[FJK 10]

My view of last traverse sequence. As usual, comments welcome.

 

I look forward to seeing you in Vegas

[Zan-shin 10]

My view of last traverse sequence. As usual, comments welcome.

Thank you for posting your chart. Is your magenta a traverse? how did your figure out "sequence complete" is at 14:45? Your skinny gaussians don't seem to match any trendlines.

[FJK 10]

Thank you for posting your chart. Is your magenta a traverse? how did your figure out "sequence complete" is at 14:45? Your skinny gaussians don't seem to match any trendlines.

 

Yes, I use Spydertraders old medium blue/magenta color codes for traverses.

 

It is the first increasing red volume bar in the 3rd tape after point 3 of the traverse, hence I label it sequence completion.

 

Re: my skinny gaussians, remember that what is inside a lateral, is a different ballgame than outside. I especially use dominant laterals to "extend" my tapes in period of congestion/chop. In these situations, you can go down the rabbit hole and annotate 4th or even 5th level gaussians if you want (I don't )

Edited November 12, 2009 by FJK

[rs5 10]

Thursday 12 November 2009

[cnms2 10]

Thursday 12 November 2009

Looking only at the volume pane: trends and peaks.

 

Disclaimer

Edited November 13, 2009 by cnms2

[dkm 10]

Looking only at the volume pane: trends and peaks.

Is this what you understand the gaussians should look like? If not, would you please post you chart. Thanks

[Gregor_S 10]

My chart for yesterday.

[dkm 10]

Looking only at the volume pane: trends and peaks.

 

Or perhaps, more logically: