Companies That Build Trading Computers?

[Guest Tresor]

F..k, there should be a tool to prevent entering the same message twice.

Edited February 1, 2009 by Tresor

[Guest Tresor]

Note that I never said that Windows can not be run natively on Mac hardware. That would join some of the other ignorant statements.

 

 

Actually, you did say that Windows cannot be run natively on MAC. I posted a link http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/114/companies-that-build-trading-computers-4533-4.html#post58281 to to prove Windows can be run natively, while you called the link is a marketing stuff.

 

Can one be more ignorant than you on the issue of Windows being able to run natively on MAC?

[sevensa 10]

Hello sevensa,

Take high end Apple and a few high end PCs. Vista on Apple will be faster.

 

"High end" is completely subjective and arbitrary. If I am going to run comparisons and is biased to Mac, I will make sure to pick a "high end" PC which is less powerfull than the Mac, vice versa if I am biased to a PC. You cannot draw any general conclusions from such a "test" other than in that specific test one system is faster than the other.

 

This is a futile argument anyway. This is like argueing which of Mercedes and BMW have the best cars. The best car/OS is the one which fits your needs the best. But just because it fits your needs the best, does not mean it is the best for everyone else and this is arrogant to suggest so.

 

The fact is that if you want to use any of the better trading software, you need Windows. You cannot get away with just a Mac.

[Guest Tresor]

"High end" is completely subjective and arbitrary. If I am going to run comparisons and is biased to Mac, I will make sure to pick a "high end" PC which is less powerfull than the Mac, vice versa if I am biased to a PC. You cannot draw any general conclusions from such a "test" other than in that specific test one system is faster than the other.

 

Hello Sevena,

 

Yes, I know it subjective. Yes, I know I cannot draw any decisive conclusions based on such tests. The whole discussion (I am becoming tired of it) started when Kiwi stated that Mac being able to run Windows natively is merely a marketing stuff. He stated this after I posted a link explaining Boot Camp.

[Kiwi 16]

If you can find me saying "Windows can not be run natively on Mac hardware" then I will be impressed. The stuff you posted is just what I originally said it was.

 

I stand by my prior statements:

 

1. Most trading software is designed to run under Windows.

2. Running windows natively on given hardware will always be faster and more reliable than some form of software shim - there are less instructions to run so both will be true by the very nature of software.

 

And would add - if you want to run trading apps then why pay a price premium to Apple for it. On the other hand if you want to run an Apple you will do it anyway for reasons that have nothing to do with speed or reliability.

[jonbig04 10]

why pay a price premium to Apple for it? On the other hand if you want to run an Apple you will do it anyway for reasons that have nothing to do with speed or reliability.

 

 

having been through ridiculous amounts of computers I can honestly say that Apples are superior....by far. It's not even close. If you don't think they are worth the premium, I suppose that's a matter of opinion. I'm no computer geek, but I don't really need to be either. Perhaps you can build a computer with windows that is great and blah blah, but when it comes to walking into a store and buying a computer retail, Apples are better than anything I have tried. Actually, take away all the speed and reliability issues from PC's and still, OSX is far better than Windows. If you think otherwise, well, you're smoking crack. If you don't believe me, run them side by side like I do every single day...the differences are pretty obvious then. You couldn't pay me to sit through the annoying, cumbersome chore that is using windows when other options are available.

[sevensa 10]

having been through ridiculous amounts of computers I can honestly say that Apples are superior....by far. It's not even close. If you don't think they are worth the premium, I suppose that's a matter of opinion. I'm no computer geek, but I don't really need to be either. Perhaps you can build a computer with windows that is great and blah blah, but when it comes to walking into a store and buying a computer retail, Apples are better than anything I have tried. Actually, take away all the speed and reliability issues from PC's and still, OSX is far better than Windows. If you think otherwise, well, you're smoking crack. If you don't believe me, run them side by side like I do every single day...the differences are pretty obvious then. You couldn't pay me to sit through the annoying, cumbersome chore that is using windows when other options are available.

 

I'd be curious to know what trading applications you are running side by side on OSX and Windows to come to your conclusion that OSX is better?

[jonbig04 10]

Trading apps? I don't know of any that run on a mac. Wish I did.

[Guest Tresor]

If you can find me saying "Windows can not be run natively on Mac hardware" then I will be impressed. The stuff you posted is just what I originally said it was.

 

Go to the message that you posted here http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/114/companies-that-build-trading-computers-4533-4.html#post58282 You wrote ''The link is marketing stuff'' in reply to my message in which I wrote one single sentence: ''this link leaves no doubt about a possibility to run Windows natively on MAC PRO: http://www.apple.com/getamac/faq/ '' Writing ''the lunk is marketing stuff'' implies ''windows cannot be run natively on Mac hardware''

 

I stand by my prior statements:

 

1. Most trading software is designed to run under Windows.

 

Never questioned this. And suggested Boot Camp to run Windows on a MAC.

 

2. Running windows natively on given hardware will always be faster and more reliable than some form of software shim - there are less instructions to run so both will be true by the very nature of software.

 

Never addressed this issue, therefore never questioned.

 

And would add - if you want to run trading apps then why pay a price premium to Apple for it. On the other hand if you want to run an Apple you will do it anyway for reasons that have nothing to do with speed or reliability.

 

I presented one option (MAC PRO) to the thread originator that I belive is worth looking at. Had you read my message in good faith, you would choose to co-operate to help the guy rather than show off with your knowlegde.

 

Why pay premium price? I believe macs have better qaulity than an average PC.

 

I rest my case.

[sevensa 10]

Trading apps? I don't know of any that run on a mac. Wish I did.

 

How can you say then that OSX is better if you don't even have apps for it available to do trading? You cannot seriously recommend a Mac for a trading computer when you don't even have native applications available for it.

 

For trading you definitely need Windows and your best bet would be a computer designed for Windows and not one which can also run Windows. If you want to design a computer for something else, then Mac might be better, but this thread is not about the best computer/OS for general usage; it is about trading computers.

[jonbig04 10]

How can you say then that OSX is better if you don't even have apps for it available to do trading? You cannot seriously recommend a Mac for a trading computer when you don't even have native applications available for it.

 

For trading you definitely need Windows and your best bet would be a computer designed for Windows and not one which can also run Windows. If you want to design a computer for something else, then Mac might be better, but this thread is not about the best computer/OS for general usage; it is about trading computers.

 

haha you should have just said that instead of asking the rhetorical question about trading apps for a mac. Anyway, I don't know if windows runs any better on my mac or on the various PC's that I've had. It seems the same to me. To prove your point you would not only have to prove definitively that windows runs better on a PC than a mac, but in such a way to actually make trading somehow easier, or better, or whatever you chose to define one computer as "better" for trading than the other. If I had to guess I would say that the difference is negligible if any. That being said even if you did find a real, noticeable, effective difference...still that is only if you have a computer dedicated for trading ONLY. If you start talking about surfing the net, downloading and actually putting some real time on this computer that is not spent in a trading app, you would have to weigh the differences that come with doing those things on a mac versus pc.

[sevensa 10]

Why pay premium price? I believe macs have better qaulity than an average PC.

I rest my case.

 

From what you have mentioned, your only experience with Mac's seems to be that you have seen your friend using it and what he has told you. Have you actually had any experience of your own with Mac's which lead you to believe that they have better quality and make you feel comfortable enough recommending it for a trading computer? If so, can you maybe give a little more information on how you are using it? i.e., bootcamp, or virtualization, what kind of apps you are using, etc... I know John is using NT on Fusion and this would be nice to hear what other configurations people use.

[sevensa 10]

haha you should have just said that instead of asking the rhetorical question about trading apps for a mac. Anyway, I don't know if windows runs any better on my mac or on the various PC's that I've had. It seems the same to me. To prove your point you would not only have to prove definitively that windows runs better on a PC than a mac, but in such a way to actually make trading somehow easier, or better, or whatever you chose to define one computer as "better" for trading than the other. If I had to guess I would say that the difference is negligible if any. That being said even if you did find a real, noticeable, effective difference...still that is only if you have a computer dedicated for trading ONLY. If you start talking about surfing the net, downloading and actually putting some real time on this computer that is not spent in a trading app, you would have to weigh the differences that come with doing those things on a mac versus pc.

 

 

In the end, the "best" computer is the one which meets all of your needs the closest and only you can decide which trade-offs you are willing to live with. For me, I just don't see the point of booting into Windows, or running it under VMWare all the time when I can have everything I need on a Windows based computer without having to juggle between two operating systems. For other people this is obviously acceptable.

 

I still think if you are talking about a pure trading computer then a PC with Windows is your best option. If you want to use it for other things also, then the picture becomes more fuzzy and I might even agree with you that a Mac might be the better option depending on your needs.

[jonbig04 10]

Good points. It's really too subjective. For my style of trading, sometimes I have to have on to trades literally all day, from open to close. So there I am, sitting, so I surf the net and do all kinds of other stuff. Thats just my situation though.

[Tasuki 10]

Gentlemen, your technical expertise is overwhelming my circuits. Let me ask a couple of simple questions:

Let's say I have Tradestation. Or Ninjatrader. Or both. And I want to run them on a Mac.

1) Is this possible?

2) Are the steps necessary very complex? If not, would someone please explain what "interface" software you need?

Thanks, Tasuki

[jonbig04 10]

I'm sure there's a million ways to do it. I don't know which is BEST. But here's how I do it. I bought a program called parallels for my mac. I installed that program, which when done, asks you to insert the windows operating systems CD (anyone will do nothing special). Then when its done doing it's thing, all you have to do is click the parallels icon and a screen pops up with windows in it. That's it.

[Tasuki 10]

jonbig,

Cheeseandcrackers that sounds almost too easy. Thanks for the info.

Tasuki

p.s. I remember a few years ago trying to run Windows on a Mac. I worked in a molecular biology lab, and we had the very best techs available. Notwithstanding, the Mac crashed CONSTANTLY when using Windows. From what I've gleaned from the preceeding conversation, Macs (and their interface with Windows) must have made some giant leaps forward. Correct? From what you and Tresor have been saying, your Macs don't ever crash when using Windows? I'd give my eyeteeth to see Tradestation running on a Mac.

[kingtodd 10]

After buying, building, upgrading, computers, I have moved to all Dell. If you get the XPS series, there is 24 hour tech support, if it breaks they come to your place to fix it for one year, which you could extend, and the best feature is the microsoft program. NO KEYS. You can reinstall XP as many times as you like, add more back up hard drives. Still stuck on XP. SAme for Vista. Dell sells the XPS 630i with XP installed. Just make sure you get the XP disk with the delivery. If you want to get cheap, go the dell outlet. Still the same service. I have a 30", 25" and two 20 inch Samsung monitors with no problems. on one system. dual Nvidia 8800gt. I use the core extreme 3000 on one and the core 2 q6600 on the other. I also use the WD raptor as the primary hard drive and a 1 terrabite slave. (all with microsoft XP installed) I tried mirroring two identicle drives as a safety so if one hard drive goes the other take over, but found it slowed things down.

 

A friend of mind who assembles system for big comanies advised me to go to Dell or another company

 

These companies that sell trading computers are just some guys building them in a room somewhere and you pay the markup. Dell has tried and tested a system.

 

I tell you after having a 30 inch main screen, you can never turn back 2048 x 1536 res.

Good luck

[86834 10]

http://www.tradingcomputers.com - where i got mine from