Ideas for Struggling Traders

[brownsfan019 17]

As much as ET can be a waste of time, every so often a thread comes along that grabs my attention.

 

This thread is one of them.

 

It's entitled - Ideas for struggling traders - and the ideas presented are fairly basic and repeatable (I think).

 

If you are struggling or just looking for a fresh idea, check that thread out.

 

I suggest checking out and maybe even taking screenshots if interested as it could easily disappear tomorrow.

[brownsfan019 17]

I received a few PM's from people that found the thread on ET worth pursuing. I'd welcome any and all feedback for others to see. The premise behind the system is one that seems easy to follow and I've been watching it intra-day to see how it runs.

 

Still too early to say much other than, candles print like crazy on a 2401 constant volume chart, that's for sure. Interesting premise w/ the moving averages as the guide.

[dandxg 10]

I think the main point is trading with price and volume. I am familiar with that thread, Steve 46 and Prof Logic. You would get similar results with 2000 CVB IMO.

 

In the past Steve was a proponent of VSA which you obviously aren't. I think a logical argument could be made for using market profile, since it's price and volume as well. Price and volume, the lowest common denominator for success IMO. S/R would be third priority on my list. Armed with those three you don't need anything else.

[That One Guy 10]

  dandxg said:

Armed with those three you don't need anything else.

 

Yeah, but it's much easier for people to have something tell them to enter. Price and volume alone requires a good amount of understanding of whats going on between the buying and selling pressure. Most people would rather wait for the green light to go long and the red light to short. This is all just my opinion, and I, have nothing against any particular trading method if it works for you.

[james_gsx 16]

This is kind of OT, but I have realized that traders who tend to struggle the most (really just don't get it) are simply trading the wrong market :\ Or they don't give enough effort and screen time - again because they don't care and are trading the wrong market.

 

That's probably for a different thread, but I like the idea of some basic trading rules to help someone get started. This could turn out well and help a lot of people get that little push. That doesn't mean someone should make a trading plan word for word what we discuss, but a small idea could help them get the ball rolling, so they could independently design their own system. If that makes sense.

 

I found that when fast time frames were burning me out I would want to go back to my plan and tweak things. Eventually I just started looking at longer time frames, and it suited my style of trading and the way I read charts much better.

[Bearbull 10]

  Jwhite198621 said:

Yeah, but it's much easier for people to have something tell them to enter. Price and volume alone requires a good amount of understanding of whats going on between the buying and selling pressure. Most people would rather wait for the green light to go long and the red light to short. This is all just my opinion, and I, have nothing against any particular trading method if it works for you.

 

Spot on Jwhite, price movement is independent of bar intervals and reading price action (buying/selling pressure) involves lots of effort/screentime, however in this age of instant gratification who wants that;)

However price action seldom lie, I would say relevant support/resistance zones as primary , then price action at these levels, as Dbphoenix has pointed out,

if your strategy requires you watch too much (indicators etc), you need to re-evaluate the strategy. The choice is up to the individual.

[brownsfan019 17]

  Bearbull said:

, I would say relevant support/resistance zones as primary , then price action at these levels, as Dbphoenix has pointed out,

if your strategy requires you watch too much (indicators etc), you need to re-evaluate the strategy. The choice is up to the individual.

 

 

If the individual is making consistent $ with 10 indicators on their screen, why on Earth change that?

 

While my setup is fairly simple, this recent "no indicators or else" wave through here is rather amusing. On that ET thread there is an easy to follow example using moving averages. Maybe that's "too much" for some, but for others that may be plenty. Maybe some like stochastics as a reinforcement. Maybe others like pivots, etc. etc.

 

Trading comes down to finding what works for YOU; whether that is bar charts by themselves or spline charts w/ 13 separate indicator windows. This business is about MAKING MONEY. Nothing else.

[Bearbull 10]

Absolutely, it is all about finding a strategy that suits your personality and then applying with discipline, I should have emphasized "too many indicators", having seen some of the charts posted on Woodie's website, nothing wrong with filtering out trades with use of stochastics, RSI etc and taking those with high probability outcome.

[cowpip 10]

  brownsfan019 said:

If the individual is making consistent $ with 10 indicators on their screen, why on Earth change that?

 

Agreed. But I've followed enough new traders around (and this applied to myself as well when I first started) to know that most new traders start with too many indicators.

 

BUT THAT'S OK. It's the process by which they learn what indicators work and what ones don't work. Generally, simple is usually better to avoid analysis-paralysis. But if someone has the brain-power to follow 10 separate indicators to generate a single buy/sell signal THAT WORKS, there's no reason to change it. But that doesn't preclude the possibility of tweaking and possibly removing extraneous indicators until you converge on something simpler and just as profitable. That's usually the challenge for new traders.

 

Even better would be to see if it's possible to separate the various indicators to create multiple workable trading strategies from them. Having more than one workable strategy is important to staying flexible in the market. One strategy for ranging markets. Another for trending. Another for scalping, etc. And don't forget to throw in wise money-management. That in itself is often a reason why new traders fail to succeed.

[bootstrap 47]

  brownsfan019 said:

If the individual is making consistent $ with 10 indicators on their screen, why on Earth change that?

 

How true. It doesn't matter what you use as long as you are making a profit.

 

But I also think that new/struggling traders are using too many. The problem is that each of the 10 they are using has the same data source. And by that I mean all of the indicators they follow use the close or some derivative of the close.

 

As long as each indicator is using a different set of data (close, H-L, pivot, volume, time, etc) or combines them in a unique way, they would be better off.

[jasont 10]

I am not a big fan of what most people refer to as "indicators" myself but use the EMA's and SMA's as what some people refer to as the lazy man's trend lines.

 

Knowing how to read charts simply by price takes a long time to learn. It is probably for the best that new traders use indicators in the beginning to help them understand the way price reacts. I know I started that way and then after substantial periods of time watching, you begin to understand price alone.

 

It eases the trader into the market and if they find that the indicators give them a good way to trade then so be it. They may as well stick with it as long as it works. Saying "too many indicators" is something that can't really be set in stone. The word indicators is subjective in itself. I believe candles, bars, ticks etc are indicators of past price so it really depends.

 

Pretty much everything we have on our charts can be construed as an indicator including different time frames of the same market, other markets we use that are correlated as well as things such as the NYSE Tick etc. So putting a number on indicators really shouldn't be as much of a focus as is making sure you have indicators that tell the individual something.

 

Some people have Stochastics that tell them the story of price whilst others have EMA's or MACD's or just bar charts and volume. We all see things differently so its just a matter of finding whatever works for the individual and over time they will add and remove different elements as their experience grows. I don't think it's fair to tell new traders to just use this or that because of X reason. I think its more beneficial to give them options so they can learn for themselves. Something continually slaps me in the face and that is that trading can't really be taught, it can only be learnt.