Using Outside Sources to Build Track Record And/or Make Additional Money...

[brownsfan019 17]

Not sure where on the forum this belongs, but here it is.

 

I was thinking this evening about what are different ways for the average trader to make money, outside of their personal trading. Of course, the obvious question is why. And my answer is, why not.

 

My idea being that generating some additional income and/or building a track record is a good idea for most serious traders. Perhaps it's one or the other, or maybe both reasons.

 

Anyways, I thought we could discuss different ways to either generate additional income and/or build an outside track record and the advantages/disadvantages of each.

 

Being late, I've come up with 2 ideas thus far:

 

Collective2

 

C2 being where you set up your own system and as a track record builds, subscribers can subscribe.

 

ADVANTAGES: Can charge a healthy fee if consistently profitable, creates a track record. Good way to test, verify or build confidence in real-time or 'forward testing'.

DISADVANTAGES: Requires dedication and work.

 

MarketZar

ADVANTAGES: Can earn money in a trading contest. Get to test your trading against others. Good way to test, verify or build confidence in real-time or 'forward testing'.

DISADVANTAGES: Mainly just a contest type thing. Idea here is you are going for the $1500 1st place prize.

 

 

I guess I wanted to start this thread to build some ideas and see where it goes. I know the seasoned traders will not see much value, but we've all been at the beginning at some point. Maybe the thread will help our new or 'broken in' traders with some additional ideas. I honestly don't know if I would want to do this myself to be perfectly honest, but C2 is an attractive option. Some systems there were charging $200+/mo. Doesn't sound like a ton, but even just 10 subscribers adds $2000/mo to your bottom line. I recall seeing a few at one point that were charging $500/mo. Point being that if you get a good system in place and if it doesn't interfere with your normal trading, an additional income source is right there.

 

For me, it's about leveraging your time. If you can trade your normal thing and then also add in a C2 or something that pays your car payment, house payment, etc., then why not, right?

 

I sometimes get way outside the box with my thinking, so I apologize if this is in way left field.

 

If nothing else, maybe we could have a TL day at MarketZar and see where our little group ends up! Could be a fun thing to do. Maybe James could contact them and get us a group discount...

 

Has anyone tried either of these or maybe some other website? Any feedback? Would anyone be interested in a MarketZar contest with TL?

[Soultrader 12]

Very interesting idea Brownsfan. I will contact MarketZar to see if we can get a group discount.

[brownsfan019 17]

Let us know James what MarketZar says. The $50 fee is not a huge fee, but any discounts are helpful!

 

Could be fun to have a TL day once a month or something at MZ. They hold contests regularly, but I know I would not be able to commit to something weekly. Once a month or quarter could work though.

[torero 10]

I like contests, this would motivate me and keep the boredom away. So MZ sounds like a nice idea.

 

As for C2, I had some experience in the past past. It's a great platform to show off (or make money) your strategies, mechanical or discretionary. One word of advice: scalping and short term trading strategies will not work. Delays in alerts arriving and trades depending on seconds to get a profit will NOT work. I did a few trials with some systems and from reading feedback and personal experience, the strats are overrated compared to the reality subscribers get.

[brownsfan019 17]

Here's a way for someone to one up MarketZar - create the same contests and such, but pay out like a poker tourney does!

 

I'm assuming MZ is making money here, but who knows how much. $1500 for first is only 30 paying people at $50/ea. I have no idea what the field size is (or could be) but if you paid out like a poker tourney - something like $50 + 5 and the size of the pots became sizable, that would make things a lot more interesting.

 

Along those lines, wonder if there's a way for TL to do this James. Just an idea - but if you created a TL trading tourney once a month or something, that could make for some good times. And it doesn't have to be a lot either - just like a $10 buy-in (or whatever is comfortable for everyone) and top 3 payout. Now, how you pull this off, no idea. I'm just the idea man.

 

[Soultrader 12]

Hi Brownsfan,

 

I was actually brainstorming last night on how a system like MZ would benefit TL tremendously. Furthermore, it will be a fun event to have.

 

The question: How would I go about building an infrastructure to do this? No clue. I guess one option would be to buy MZ.

 

Another option would be to negotiate with a brokerage firm that can host such events on our site using their platform.

 

I will definitely look into this... though it will probably be a long stretch to host such events here on TL.

[brownsfan019 17]

Hi Brownsfan,

 

I was actually brainstorming last night on how a system like MZ would benefit TL tremendously. Furthermore, it will be a fun event to have.

 

The question: How would I go about building an infrastructure to do this? No clue. I guess one option would be to buy MZ.

 

Another option would be to negotiate with a brokerage firm that can host such events on our site using their platform.

 

I will definitely look into this... though it will probably be a long stretch to host such events here on TL.

 

I think you have an in @ Infinity, so I would start there. The pitch is easy - use their software that day on simulation, you do the back office stuff and they get some great exposure.

 

I know, easier said than done.

[torero 10]

Doesn't sound like a bad idea. The only thing is if they already have the simulation, it isn't that much more into creating special accounts for contestants. Yes, by using their platform for platform, people will get hooked the more chance they get to use it. I like BF's idea, it's about time we need a contest on this site. I'm betting I can beat BF at his own game! (JK!) or at least BF holds a bar we can all try to reach.

[Soultrader 12]

This is definitely not going to be easy. But I will contact a few firms to see if they are interested.

[mister ed 10]

I was thinking this evening about what are different ways for the average trader to make money, outside of their personal trading.

 

This might be a stupid question ... here goes ... is managing money an option? There are many formats in which this can be done, taking on some private funds, working for an institution in some way, all the way to setting up a fund. Get the legals right so you can continue to trade for yourself as well.

 

Any thoughts on this from anyone who knows more about it than me (ummmm...that makes everyone qualified:rofl:)?

[brownsfan019 17]

This might be a stupid question ... here goes ... is managing money an option? There are many formats in which this can be done, taking on some private funds, working for an institution in some way, all the way to setting up a fund. Get the legals right so you can continue to trade for yourself as well.

 

Any thoughts on this from anyone who knows more about it than me (ummmm...that makes everyone qualified:rofl:)?

 

Most definitely Mr Ed! I was looking for quick and easy options but you are correct - the real money is in OPM (Other Peoples' Money). There are a few different avenues to take on the daytrading side. The main two that come to mind right now (in futures) would be a CTA or Hedge Fund setup. Of course, there's more to it than just setting up a website and such, but it is a great way to go for the LONG TERM and if you want to go that route.

 

The nice thing about C2 and/or MarketZar is that it's quick and easy.

[brownsfan019 17]

Doesn't sound like a bad idea. The only thing is if they already have the simulation, it isn't that much more into creating special accounts for contestants. Yes, by using their platform for platform, people will get hooked the more chance they get to use it. I like BF's idea, it's about time we need a contest on this site. I'm betting I can beat BF at his own game! (JK!) or at least BF holds a bar we can all try to reach.

 

Sounds like a threat there Tor...

 

:evil tongue:

[torero 10]

Let's get ready to RUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUMBLE!!!!!:crap:

[brownsfan019 17]

This will be right up Ronin's ally as well! If he participates Tor, we can only hope for 2nd place.

 

[torero 10]

See the little green guy? That's me, by hurting myself, I'll be hurting you!!! Yowser!

[brownsfan019 17]

See the little green guy? That's me, by hurting myself, I'll be hurting you!!! Yowser!

 

I see what you did there...

 

How about this...

 

You will feel like :puke: after you say :ciao: to 1st place.

 

No doubt will set in and you'll spend hours :missy: wondering how I did it.

 

And in the end, all you'll get is: :bang head: & :shrug: & :hmmmm:

 

You'll simply be left... :applaud:

 

 

 

Ok, that's gotta be some kind of smilie record or something...

[torero 10]

Dang, BF, you got time today dontcha!:haha:

 

I'd cut down on that puking icon, it's very graphic, gonna have to ban you on that one!!!! (jk).

[brownsfan019 17]

Dang, BF, you got time today dontcha!:haha:

 

I'd cut down on that puking icon, it's very graphic, gonna have to ban you on that one!!!! (jk).

 

Yeah, only 3 trades so far. Killing some time now I guess.

[torero 10]

Why don't you kill time on the chat room with us? I'm killing it too... again and again.

[brownsfan019 17]

James - any luck with MarketZar discounts?

 

If not, there are free sessions as well.

 

Just thought of this per our discussion over here.

[mezameo 10]

anyone have any experience with collective2? I was thinking it could be rather lucrative, for the small traders, if you could get an autotrade agreement with a broker or two.

[brownsfan019 17]

anyone have any experience with collective2? I was thinking it could be rather lucrative, for the small traders, if you could get an autotrade agreement with a broker or two.

 

That's the beauty of C2 mez - they already have the auto-trading arrangements in place. All you do is put in your trades. If someone subscribers, they can set it up to be auto-traded through one of C2's brokers.

[Hlm 10]

So is collective2 one of the best ways to go? What if someone has no interest in "subscriptions" but wants to keep a legitimate record of a strategy for potentially larger clients? I do like that fact that collective2 has decent software options including APIs and that they are priced fairly. Has anyone else had any personal experience with other such services? The service would have to have the ability to track futures and FX as well.

 

Edit: I just noticed that this is my 100th post.

[brownsfan019 17]

So is collective2 one of the best ways to go? What if someone has no interest in "subscriptions" but wants to keep a legitimate record of a strategy for potentially larger clients? I do like that fact that collective2 has decent software options including APIs and that they are priced fairly. Has anyone else had any personal experience with other such services? The service would have to have the ability to track futures and FX as well.

 

Edit: I just noticed that this is my 100th post.

 

hlm - C2 offers the ability to turn off subscriptions. So if you just want to run something on a 3rd party client but not fuss with subscriptions, you can do that too.

[Hlm 10]

Thanks for the reply brownsfan019. I plan to at least give them a try once my system gets past its next phase. I really like the idea of being able to place trades via a URL string (Documentation HERE). This makes it extremely easy to program execution across different applications.