Jump to content

Welcome to the new Traders Laboratory! Please bear with us as we finish the migration over the next few days. If you find any issues, want to leave feedback, get in touch with us, or offer suggestions please post to the Support forum here.

  • Welcome Guests

    Welcome. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest which does not give you access to all the great features at Traders Laboratory such as interacting with members, access to all forums, downloading attachments, and eligibility to win free giveaways. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free. Create a FREE Traders Laboratory account here.

brownsfan019

Review of Open ECry (futures broker)

Recommended Posts

Guest cooter

For me, working with OEC has been the best broker I've EVER dealt with. This includes going from Alaron, to ProActive Futures and Mirus Futures. The only one I will warn of is Alaron. I just didn't like what I saw (and paid). ProActive and Mirus are good, but as an IB, there's only so much they can do on commissions to be competitive.

 

So, how are you finding the OEC Trader and DOM compared to your other broker's software?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
So, how are you finding the OEC Trader and DOM compared to your other broker's software?

 

Good question cooter. For the most part, it's on par or exceeding previous softwares that I've used, including the $500/mo T4 that I was on. I have one thing that I am working on getting them to change though - I would like the DOM to re-center more quickly. In a volatile time, the price can be off-centered quite a bit and I don't care for that. I'm hoping they can consider at least giving the user the option to re-center more often. What are your thoughts on that?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter

A few thoughts...

 

A button on the DOM itself to manually re-center would be nice. Something where you could easily turn on and off centering on the DOM itself, without having to mess with the DOM settings dialog.

 

The volume histogram feature on the DOM is a long overdue addition.

 

The new tiered brackets (called Strategy Order) is somewhat clunky in operation, and only has three tiers (five would have been optimal), but it does allow users to save separate bracket profiles for each DOM.

 

Market if Touched orders are finally supported in this release, and are available on the DOM.

 

One thing you might want to do is compare the speed of the OEC DOM versus another brokers, though. I was surprised to find the Transact AT just a smidgen faster than OEC, for both CME and CBOT contracts.

 

All-in-all, this upgrade (3.1.1.1) is well worth the wait.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

RESULT: VERY CLEAN SHEET. That's important to me and hard to do in the futures biz.

 

FCM Capital Data direct from the CFTC - http://www.cftc.gov/marketreports/financialdataforfcms/index.htm

 

Hey brownsfan,

 

Thanks for the info you've been providing on OEC. I've actually been taking a look at them as well based on your recommendation. One concern I have about them is that they barely have $1M in net capital. I would expect a company in a strong financial position to have more like many others at the link you provided. I don't know if I could get past this. Does this concern you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Hey brownsfan,

 

Thanks for the info you've been providing on OEC. I've actually been taking a look at them as well based on your recommendation. One concern I have about them is that they barely have $1M in net capital. I would expect a company in a strong financial position to have more like many others at the link you provided. I don't know if I could get past this. Does this concern you?

 

I was more concerned about the segregated accounts number since that represents client assets. $29 mill is not a ton, but enough for my consideration. As for the net capital, it is above the requirement set by the CFTC and NFA. I'll email my contact and see what the response is to that number and let you know what I find out.

 

My biggest concern would be that NFA report. If there were a ton of cases and arbitration, I would not even bother looking at the CFTC report, regardless of how much money is at the firm.

 

Like I said, I think with OEC you are getting a firm that is constantly improving their software for their traders and large enough to be a player, small enough for you and me to trade there at competitive commission rates.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter

One other thing....

 

There's an old issue that has resurfaced with this recent release (3.1.1.1) concerning the display of the correct open P/L on the DOM for side-by-side electronic and pit contracts. This value also shows up incorrectly in the open P/L on the Account Summary.

 

During RTH, when both are trading, the DOM will show the open P/L on the electronic DOM based on the pit quotes - even if you didn't place a pit order. ZBU7 and USU7 are prime examples of this. It also shows in the Account Summary too.

 

Why?

 

If the pit contract has different quotes (which is often the case) then this would cause the electronic P/L to show the wrong open P/L, based on the pit contract. The only instance where this might be tolerable is if a pit order was pending or executed on the same side-by-side contract. However, this activity is happening even when no pit order is made, let alone contemplated.

 

Let's stop and think about this for a second.

 

You are trading the 30 yr bond electronic contract (ZB). It has a side-by-side fungible pit contract (US) as well. This means that you can open one position on either contract, and close it out on the other, if you like.

 

With OEC you have the luxury of being able to trade pit contracts via the DOM without having to pick up the phone and call your pit broker. So the DOM for pit contracts looks and feels pretty much the same as the DOM for electronic contract (except that there isn't a price ladder full of pending orders).

 

If you place a pit order, the open P/L will be displayed on the DOM, in the same manner as an electronic order. Where the contracts are side-by-side, the same open position will be reflected on the other contract, since you can close out the position with either contract.

 

However, the quotes for each contract may differ, since the pit and electronic contracts are "separate but equal" contracts. So during open outcry hours (RTH), you can have two different prices for essentially the same instrument - one pit-traded, and one electronically-traded.

 

But what if you are trading electronically, and don't really care about the pit-contract? Well, the open P/L for your trade should be based solely upon the electronic contract - after all, that's what you're trading, isn't it.

 

Only if you choose to exit your position on the pit contract, should the P/L change if the quote is different.

 

So, let's say you have an open position on the ZB 30 yr bond electronic sometime during RTH. Say 10 cars. Decent size, right? And the open P/L in the DOM ***and*** Account Summary both show $312.50 (tick value is $31.25/tick).

 

Whoo-hoo! You think you've got a winner - one tick is better than nothing. Your limit order is hit, and your position is closed. But wait!

 

To your chagrin, your Realized P/L on the Account Summary is FLAT? How is that?

 

Turns out that the OPEN P/L you saw was based on the pit contract which was one tick up on the electronic quote. But the REAL P/L for your contract was NOT shown on the DOM or account summary - until the contract was closed, and the P/L was "realized".

 

It may not be a big deal if you are "nickel-and-dime"ing it one contract at a time, but start pushing a few contracts and this issue could bite you one day too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
As for the net capital, it is above the requirement set by the CFTC and NFA. I'll email my contact and see what the response is to that number and let you know what I find out.

 

Brownsfan, do you know what the CFTC and NFA requirement is and what happens when a firm falls below the requirement? I thought the requirement was $1M in net capital and Open ECry has $1.029M according to the link. Anyway, I'll wait to see what you find out.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
One other thing....

 

There's an old issue that has resurfaced with this recent release (3.1.1.1) concerning the display of the correct open P/L on the DOM for side-by-side electronic and pit contracts. This value also shows up incorrectly in the open P/L on the Account Summary.

 

Not good! That's worse than TradeStation showing cumulative daily P&L in their Matrix.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Brownsfan, do you know what the CFTC and NFA requirement is and what happens when a firm falls below the requirement? I thought the requirement was $1M in net capital and Open ECry has $1.029M according to the link. Anyway, I'll wait to see what you find out.

 

Here is what I found out tonight regarding the capital that is reported on the CFTC report:

 

We have the same question from most of the larger clients or IBs we are in talks with. We basically keep a bit more than the minimum requirement. We have ready capital in reserve that we can / do bring in to support additional business as required.

 

Now, I've dealt with this contact since day one of my talks with OEC in considering brining my biz there, so I trust his word. This is not just a regular broker you deal with at OEC.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
A few thoughts...

 

A button on the DOM itself to manually re-center would be nice. Something where you could easily turn on and off centering on the DOM itself, without having to mess with the DOM settings dialog.

 

Cooter - doesn't the 'Go To Last' button the DOM do exactly what you are asking here?

 

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2483&stc=1&d=1187797695

 

 

 

And if you just want to center it manually, you could just turn off the 'Auto Center Price' in the setup:

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2484&stc=1&d=1187797790

tl.png.95ca757f31b7ab3a9a2cb441c78f7738.png

tl2.png.5a9dd0d5d599d9b3d3be909707029274.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter
Cooter - doesn't the 'Go To Last' button the DOM do exactly what you are asking here?

 

 

attachment.php?attachmentid=2483&stc=1&d=1187797695

 

 

Yeah, must have been late at night for me too. Guess it's the placement of where that button is located on the DOM that made me think it wasn't there...

 

I'm loathe to even think of touching that button though for fear of accidentally sending a market order through - although I suppose that turning the order confirmation back on would alleviate that concern.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter
Cooter - you will be happy to know that OEC is aware of the situation you have outlined here and Rob is working on the fix. It has something to do with time stamps. No ETA given at this point.

 

Well, "timestamps" seems like a specious reason to me, IMHO, when it's actually the logic of using pit quotes to calculate open P/L on an electronic contract that is the core issue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter

Anyone have problems with OEC and their bracket orders lately?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter

Bracket orders not filling properly.

 

Stops and targets (OCO) on bracket not entered/held when main order accepted.

 

Or main order triggered, and bracket order stops and targets rejected and cancelled outright.

 

This puts both me and OEC at risk when stops and targets for intended brackets aren't accepted and are cancelled, while the main order sits live and working.

 

IMHO, they should reject the entire bracket order if any piece of it is not going to being filled or accepted to begin with.

 

Supposedly there's a fix going into the system this evening.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter
There apparently was some sort of major fiasco the other day over at OEC...

 

Well, some folks had their bracket orders "disappear", only to find that they were still alive and working, but not appearing on the DOM.

 

Here's a few posts elsewhere about it: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=103390

 

Curious to hear what you've found out about what's going on over there too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Per your requests...

A brief break-down of the issue on Friday:

The CME servers (as a standard practice) send out a "heartbeat" request to all of their incoming connections at regular intervals. If the CME doesn't not receive a response back within specified parameters, it will effectively disable that connection to the exchange. At 10:26AM the response from OEC to the CME was not received and our connection was disabled by the exchange. At 10:35AM the connection was restored but was not performing as expected. Our tech team made a decision to resolve the issue but resetting the connection at 11:42AM.

 

The particular issue has been isolated and addressed.

 

We take great pride in our up-time and reliability and go to pretty extensive lengths to strive for 100% uptime. I will also note that we went to great length on Friday to address any reported customer issues. If a customer reported an issue, we did some verification and agreed to do a full refund (not too many other firms do this...and I don't think we get much (any) credit for the way we handle such issues)

 

 

-----------------------------

 

Here's my take - sh*t happens. It happens at most/all brokers at some point. What counts is how the broker handles it. While at TradeStation, if something like this happened and I requested any type of refund or reimbursement, they would have laughed and said 'read the agreement you signed'. Same thing at ProActive. Same thing when I was a stockbroker - if a system went down, oh well, tough luck.

 

So, if OEC is willing to back their stuff up with MONEY, that works for me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Per your requests...

A brief break-down of the issue on Friday:

The CME servers (as a standard practice) send out a "heartbeat" request to all of their incoming connections at regular intervals. If the CME doesn't not receive a response back within specified parameters, it will effectively disable that connection to the exchange. At 10:26AM the response from OEC to the CME was not received and our connection was disabled by the exchange. At 10:35AM the connection was restored but was not performing as expected. Our tech team made a decision to resolve the issue but resetting the connection at 11:42AM.

 

The particular issue has been isolated and addressed.

 

We take great pride in our up-time and reliability and go to pretty extensive lengths to strive for 100% uptime. I will also note that we went to great length on Friday to address any reported customer issues. If a customer reported an issue, we did some verification and agreed to do a full refund (not too many other firms do this...and I don't think we get much (any) credit for the way we handle such issues)

 

 

-----------------------------

 

Here's my take - sh*t happens. It happens at most/all brokers at some point. What counts is how the broker handles it. While at TradeStation, if something like this happened and I requested any type of refund or reimbursement, they would have laughed and said 'read the agreement you signed'. Same thing at ProActive. Same thing when I was a stockbroker - if a system went down, oh well, tough luck.

 

So, if OEC is willing to back their stuff up with MONEY, that works for me.

 

You are definitely right.

 

I wasn't aware of the outcome. Thanks for posting that.

 

Money Talks- BS Walks. Most definitely.

 

That is impressive.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Money Talks- BS Walks. Most definitely.

 

 

You said it. Words mean nothing to me if you can't back them up.

 

OEC obviously talks the talk and walks the walk.

 

I stand by my ringing endorsement of OEC as the ONE futures firm that you SHOULD be trading at.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest cooter

I stand by my ringing endorsement of OEC as the ONE futures firm that you SHOULD be trading at.

 

Have they fixed the outstanding issue with bracket orders yet? This is another issue that caused problems for some traders recently. I didn't see a fix or upgrade yet....

 

IMHO, when you get to the point of having to run Camtasia Studio on all your trades, "just in case", you have to wonder....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Have they fixed the outstanding issue with bracket orders yet? This is another issue that caused problems for some traders recently. I didn't see a fix or upgrade yet....

 

IMHO, when you get to the point of having to run Camtasia Studio on all your trades, "just in case", you have to wonder....

 

My brackets are fine Cooter, so I didn't ask.

 

If it's that big of a concern, then shop around and see what's out there. There's plenty of FCM's and IB's to trade through; however, I wonder how many would step up AND take responsibility like OEC has done.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't know a whole lot about OEC and a few things always seemed weird to me, as other brokers have their own quirks...but to back up a statement like that with MONEY....that earns some respect...Word are cheap and easy...but once again Money Talks-BS Walks.

 

I'll give it to OEC on this one. I definitely noticed.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Topics

  • Posts

    • My wife Robin just wanted some groceries.   Simple enough.   She parked the car for fifteen minutes, and returned to find a huge scratch on the side.   Someone keyed her car.   To be clear, this isn’t just any car.   It’s a Cybertruck—Elon Musk's stainless-steel spaceship on wheels. She bought it back in 2021, before Musk became everyone's favorite villain or savior.   Someone saw it parked in a grocery lot and felt compelled to carve their hatred directly into the metal.   That's what happens when you stand out.   Nobody keys a beige minivan.   When you're polarizing, you're impossible to ignore. But the irony is: the more attention something has, the harder it is to find the truth about it.   What’s Elon Musk really thinking? What are his plans? What will happen with DOGE? Is he deserving of all of this adoration and hate? Hard to say.   Ideas work the same way.   Take tariffs, for example.   Tariffs have become the Cybertrucks of economic policy. People either love them or hate them. Even if they don’t understand what they are and how they work. (Most don’t.)   That’s why, in my latest podcast (link below), I wanted to explore the “in-between” truth about tariffs.   And like Cybertrucks, I guess my thoughts on tariffs are polarizing.   Greg Gutfield mentioned me on Fox News. Harvard professors hate me now. (I wonder if they also key Cybertrucks?)   But before I show you what I think about tariffs… I have to mention something.   We’re Headed to Austin, Texas This weekend, my team and I are headed to Austin. By now, you should probably know why.   Yes, SXSW is happening. But my team and I are doing something I think is even better.   We’re putting on a FREE event on “Tech’s Turning Point.”   AI, quantum, biotech, crypto, and more—it’s all on the table.   Just now, we posted a special webpage with the agenda.   Click here to check it out and add it to your calendar.   The Truth About Tariffs People love to panic about tariffs causing inflation.   They wave around the ghost of the Smoot-Hawley Tariff from the Great Depression like it’s Exhibit A proving tariffs equal economic collapse.   But let me pop this myth:   Tariffs don’t cause inflation. And no, I'm not crazy (despite what angry professors from Harvard or Stanford might tweet at me).   Here's the deal.   Inflation isn’t when just a couple of things become pricier. It’s when your entire shopping basket—eggs, shirts, Netflix subscriptions, bananas, everything—starts costing more because your money’s worth less.   Inflation means your dollars aren’t stretching as far as they used to.   Take the 1800s.   For nearly a century, 97% of America’s revenue came from tariffs. Income tax? Didn’t exist. And guess what inflation was? Basically zero. Maybe 1% a year.   The economy was booming, and tariffs funded nearly everything. So, why do people suddenly think tariffs cause inflation today?   Tariffs are taxes on imports, yes, but prices are set by supply and demand—not tariffs.   Let me give you a simple example.   Imagine fancy potato chips from Canada cost $10, and a 20% tariff pushes that to $12. Everyone panics—prices rose! Inflation!   Nope.   If I only have $100 to spend and the price of my favorite chips goes up, I either stop buying chips or I buy, say, fewer newspapers.   If everyone stops buying newspapers because they’re overspending on chips, newspapers lower their prices or go out of business.   Overall spending stays the same, and inflation doesn’t budge.   Three quick scenarios:   We buy pricier chips, but fewer other things: Inflation unchanged. Manufacturers shift to the U.S. to avoid tariffs: Inflation unchanged (and more jobs here). We stop buying fancy chips: Prices drop again. Inflation? Still unchanged. The only thing that actually causes inflation is printing money.   Between 2020 and 2022 alone, 40% of all money ever created in history appeared overnight.   That’s why inflation shot up afterward—not because of tariffs.   Back to tariffs today.   Still No Inflation Unlike the infamous Smoot-Hawley blanket tariff (imagine Oprah handing out tariffs: "You get a tariff, and you get a tariff!"), today's tariffs are strategic.   Trump slapped tariffs on chips from Taiwan because we shouldn’t rely on a single foreign supplier for vital tech components—especially if that supplier might get invaded.   Now Taiwan Semiconductor is investing $100 billion in American manufacturing.   Strategic win, no inflation.   Then there’s Canada and Mexico—our friendly neighbors with weirdly huge tariffs on things like milk and butter (299% tariff on butter—really, Canada?).   Trump’s not blanketing everything with tariffs; he’s pressuring trade partners to lower theirs.   If they do, everybody wins. If they don’t, well, then we have a strategic trade chess game—but still no inflation.   In short, tariffs are about strategy, security, and fairness—not inflation.   Yes, blanket tariffs from the Great Depression era were dumb. Obviously. Today's targeted tariffs? Smart.   Listen to the whole podcast to hear why I think this.   And by the way, if you see a Cybertruck, don’t key it. Robin doesn’t care about your politics; she just likes her weird truck.   Maybe read a good book, relax, and leave cars alone.   (And yes, nobody keys Volkswagens, even though they were basically created by Hitler. Strange world we live in.) Source: https://altucherconfidential.com/posts/the-truth-about-tariffs-busting-the-inflation-myth    Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/       
    • No, not if you are comparing apples to apples. What we call “poor” is obviously a pretty high bar but if you’re talking about like a total homeless shambling skexie in like San Fran then, no. The U.S.A. in not particularly kind to you. It is not an abuse so much as it is a sad relatively minor consequence of our optimism and industriousness.   What you consider rich changes with circumstances obviously. If you are genuinely poor in the U.S.A., you experience a quirky hodgepodge of unhelpful and/or abstract extreme lavishnesses while also being alienated from your social support network. It’s about the same as being a refugee. For a fraction of the ‘kindness’ available to you in non bio-available form, you could have simply stayed closer to your people and been MUCH better off.   It’s just a quirk of how we run the place and our values; we are more worried about interfering with people’s liberty and natural inclination to do for themselves than we are about no bums left behind. It is a slightly hurtful position and we know it; we are just scared to death of socialism cancer and we’re willing to put our money where our mouth is.   So, if you’re a bum; you got 5G, the ER will spend like $1,000,000 on you over a hangnail but then kick you out as soon as you’re “stabilized”, the logistics are surpremely efficient, you have total unchecked freedom of speech, real-estate, motels, and jobs are all natural healthy markets in perfect competition, you got compulsory three ‘R’’s, your military owns the sky, sea, space, night, information-space, and has the best hairdos, you can fill out paper and get all the stuff up to and including a Ph.D. Pretty much everything a very generous, eager, flawless go-getter with five minutes to spare would think you might need.   It’s worse. Our whole society is competitive and we do NOT value or make any kumbaya exception. The last kumbaya types we had werr the Shakers and they literally went extinct. Pueblo peoples are still around but they kind of don’t count since they were here before us. So basically, if you’re poor in the U.S.A., you are automatically a loser and a deadbeat too. You will be treated as such by anybody not specifically either paid to deal with you or shysters selling bejesus, Amway, and drugs. Plus, it ain’t safe out there. Not everybody uses muhfreedoms to lift their truck, people be thugging and bums are very vulnerable here. The history of a large mobile workforce means nobody has a village to go home to. Source: https://askdaddy.quora.com/Are-the-poor-people-in-the-United-States-the-richest-poor-people-in-the-world-6   Profits from free accurate cryptos signals: https://www.predictmag.com/ 
    • TDUP ThredUp stock, watch for a top of range breakout above 2.94 at https://stockconsultant.com/?TDUP
    • TDUP ThredUp stock, watch for a top of range breakout above 2.94 at https://stockconsultant.com/?TDUP
    • TDUP ThredUp stock, watch for a top of range breakout above 2.94 at https://stockconsultant.com/?TDUP
×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.