Where Does One Find a Mentor?

[neeko13 10]

Hi All,

I have been working on trading for at least 8 years at this point. I have not been able to be successful enough to make a career out of. I am located in AZ and would love to find a local mentor to assist in helping me on making this a career.

 

Is there any one out there that can provide direction?

[zdo 20]

Is DBP in Phoenix?

Maybe PM him.

hth

[MightyMouse 12]

Hi All,

I have been working on trading for at least 8 years at this point. I have not been able to be successful enough to make a career out of. I am located in AZ and would love to find a local mentor to assist in helping me on making this a career.

 

Is there any one out there that can provide direction?

 

8 years x 42 weeks x 35 hours x $12.00 an hour is $17,640 a year or $141,000 total.

 

To earn $17,640 on a relatively consistent basis, you to have somewhere between $175,000 and $265,000 of capital available.

 

Trading as a career is a trade off. If you can make more trading than working, then you trade, else just work and don't waste your time.

 

No mentor is going to show you how to trade for a fee. They will take your fee and show you what they know which is probably what you already know. It will be another bad trade for you.

[engulf 10]

The only real "mentors" I know of are in the APA Zones mentorship, but it's is not cheap. The program really did help my trading and was worth it, but I'm sure any true mentor is worth the investment, no matter where you find them. The other thing that helped me was pure luck, a friend in college has a Dad who has been trading over 20 years. Sometime we just walk into the help we need.

[jpennybags 11]

Hi All,

I have been working on trading for at least 8 years at this point. I have not been able to be successful enough to make a career out of. I am located in AZ and would love to find a local mentor to assist in helping me on making this a career.

 

Is there any one out there that can provide direction?

 

Neeko...

 

I probably don't need to tell you that "eight years is a long time". I don't know what you mean by "working on trading". If you mean: "I've been thinking about trading" or, "I have been dabbling in trading"... well, that's one thing. If you are telling us that, you've been living in your parent's basement trading everyday, and you still haven't made it... well, that's another thing entirely. If it's some scenario like the latter, then well... "eight years is a long time", and you may benefit more from an intervention than a mentor.

 

As much as I can not explain everything that goes on in the world, possibly a mentor would be of help to you. How to find one? I don't know... which was your question.

 

Sorry to not have been more help...

 

Edit: Actually, come to think of it, eight years is a long time to be "thinking about", or "dabbling in" anything. Trading may not be what you are seeking, and there really are better things to do with your time (life). Speaking as a mentor(?).

Edited December 2, 2015 by jpennybags

[zdo 20]

Thank you, MM and JP. There is deep wisdom in your dis(en)couragements.

 

But let’s also honor the fire within that is still burning after 8 years... and his concomitant commitment.

We could generalize about typical 2 yrs of ‘fire’ and’ if you haven’t’ by 5 years, etc . etc. but each of us is a sample of one...

 

All traders near the big distribution’s ‘mean’ are losers!

Passing the cusp into ‘surviving’ is mult. std.dev’s away...

Passing the cusp into ‘thriving’ is way tail ... NOT normal !

 

Likely the OP is gone now so the following is for the general audience ---

 

Developing traders need to differentiate for themselves the differences btwn

Trading Therapy

Trading Training

Trading Coaching

Trading Mentoring

Don't lump mush them all together or confuse (or try to substitute) one for the other(s)

Developing traders need to differentiate for themselves what their specific needs are for each of those...

 

.,. will find some time to discuss this further if requested.

 

all the best

 

zdo

 

 

PS engulf says "Sometime we just walk into the help we need. "

another way of saying same =

"When the student is ready the teacher will appear."

[jpennybags 11]

\

 

PS engulf says "Sometime we just walk into the help we need. "

another way of saying same =

"When the student is ready the teacher will appear."

 

Actually...very wise words, Who knows what will be? I have my doubts... but then again, I had my doubts about myself (not at eight years... more like 18 months). There is a point... and for me it was when I broke out of the break-even-trader mode. At that time I began to build things exponentially. I couldn't point to one thing that made it possible. It may have been an increased confidence, or it may have been increased winnings... or, more likely it was a combination of both (and maybe a bit of maturity in the business),

 

I suppose it can happen at any place in time. The damaged goods I was at 18 months (good gawd)... Well... damn... eight years? I can't imagine...

[MightyMouse 12]

 

Developing traders need to differentiate for themselves the differences btwn

Trading Therapy

Trading Training

Trading Coaching

Trading Mentoring

 

Nice list. Add to the list:

 

Trading reality

Trading healing (learning to forget about the trading fantasy)

 

8 years sounds like a sentence to me. I am guessing he is single. I only hope he has the capital needed to make money if he ever does get the help he needs to be "successful".

 

If he wants to learn how to trade, he should buy, say, a car for a few hundred dollars and try to sell it for more. If he can do that a few times, he'll be on his way to understanding how assets are valued or he'll end up with a pile of rusting vehicles on his lot. It could be that he ends up liking car trading instead.

[zdo 20]

MM,

nope.

It’s two separate lists

 

Your list:

Trading reality

Trading healing (learning to forget about the trading fantasy)

is on top

 

My list:

Trading Therapy

Trading Training

Trading Coaching

Trading Mentoring

is what traders can do when they can’t pull off your list on their own... when they turn to others for help...

 

and MM

I'm hatin on your fkn list

:helloooo:

surprised? :rofl:

Here's why --- I would never advise anyone to give up ( forget ) the trading 'fantasy'. The vision is central. ... extremely valuable when refined.

Btw - and refining it does not mean adjusting it to reality!

It's the other way around. It's consistently working directly in and on the discrepancies btwn the vision and accurate assessment of current realities...

 

but that brings discomforts that most end up trying to avoid... they end up

relieved...in a rusting 'inner' car lot...

 

Ya'll have a great weekend.

 

zdo

[Arms race 10]

But let’s also honor the fire within that is still burning after 8 years... and his concomitant commitment.

We could generalize about typical 2 yrs of ‘fire’ and’ if you haven’t’ by 5 years, etc . etc. but each of us is a sample of one...

 

On the other hand, trading is very similar to gambling, from the emotional response it elicits, so in the worst case, he's just plain addicted.

 

On where one finds a mentor, I have no idea. Trading is very rare occupation. I've always supposed these people would seek you out, once you show promise.

 

By the way, if the threadstarter could clarify what he exactly means by "not successful enough to make a career out of it", that would be helpful. Have you, over the long run, made a single dime yet?

[MightyMouse 12]

MM,

nope.

It’s two separate lists

 

Your list:

Trading reality

Trading healing (learning to forget about the trading fantasy)

is on top

 

My list:

Trading Therapy

Trading Training

Trading Coaching

Trading Mentoring

is what traders can do when they can’t pull off your list on their own... when they turn to others for help...

 

and MM

I'm hatin on your fkn list

:helloooo:

surprised? :rofl:

Here's why --- I would never advise anyone to give up ( forget ) the trading 'fantasy'. The vision is central. ... extremely valuable when refined.

Btw - and refining it does not mean adjusting it to reality!

It's the other way around. It's consistently working directly in and on the discrepancies btwn the vision and accurate assessment of current realities...

 

but that brings discomforts that most end up trying to avoid... they end up

relieved...in a rusting 'inner' car lot...

 

Ya'll have a great weekend.

 

zdo

 

I feel very comfortable advising people to give up or not start. Simply, most people do not have enough money to trade. If one is an "expert" trader, he still needs to have enough money to trade to pay bills and enjoy life.

 

I also advise children, including my children, to not spend the money on a BA or BS if they do not intend on using the degree. If they want to get a degree in Art, History, English, etc and then get a job somewhere unrelated to Art, History, or English, then do not waste your time. Spend money on learning things that others, who studied Art, History, and English, do not know how to do.

 

If you love Art, History, or English, then spend your spare time devouring all the Art, History,, and English that you can.

[DbPhoenix 42]

I feel very comfortable advising people to give up or not start. Simply, most people do not have enough money to trade. If one is an "expert" trader, he still needs to have enough money to trade to pay bills and enjoy life.

 

After 15 years of this, I've come to the same conclusion (actually I came to this conclusion some time ago). New "traders" should be confronted with the realities of trading at the very beginning. Instead they're greeted with squads of cheerleaders. And go on month after month, year after year (the longest I've seen so far is nineteen), pursuing their "vision" and barely breaking even, if that.

 

The number of people with whom I've come into contact who are cut out for this is astonishingly low (not much different from the "success rate" that everyone refers to). But there are a few out there. The rest are apparently just overwhelmingly lonely.

 

Db

[neeko13 10]

Well thank you all for replying to which only one of you answered how to find a mentor but it was sheer luck.

 

I have blown up a 10k account that was given to me when I started. I then put 10k into my own account and over the course of 3-4 years of trading futures with technical and fundamental analysis of the markets I ended up dead even at 10k. I have made several thousand trades I am sure at this point. Thankfully i have a job that is 100% commission so I make a solid amount of income and have an incredibly flexible schedule.

 

I am currently playing with Iron Condors/Flys on the VXX, SPX and UVXY. I have traded currencies, Futures, options and equities.

 

I have a bunch of experience at it but nothing that I can place my confidence in. Yes 8 years has been a long time and worth every experience. I have made great trades, and I have missed many more that were good trades. One should recognize that if someone works at something for 8 years without giving up, the idea should be they must have a passion.

 

I just need to find someone to help me with it. Lets get back on topic please. Does anyone know of a mentor in phoenix or I guess really anywhere that perhaps would be willing to assist in trading?

[DbPhoenix 42]

Well thank you all for replying to which only one of you answered how to find a mentor but it was sheer luck.

 

I have blown up a 10k account that was given to me when I started. I then put 10k into my own account and over the course of 3-4 years of trading futures with technical and fundamental analysis of the markets I ended up dead even at 10k. I have made several thousand trades I am sure at this point. Thankfully i have a job that is 100% commission so I make a solid amount of income and have an incredibly flexible schedule.

 

I am currently playing with Iron Condors/Flys on the VXX, SPX and UVXY. I have traded currencies, Futures, options and equities.

 

I have a bunch of experience at it but nothing that I can place my confidence in. Yes 8 years has been a long time and worth every experience. I have made great trades, and I have missed many more that were good trades. One should recognize that if someone works at something for 8 years without giving up, the idea should be they must have a passion.

 

I just need to find someone to help me with it. Lets get back on topic please. Does anyone know of a mentor in phoenix or I guess really anywhere that perhaps would be willing to assist in trading?

 

Whether or not you have a passion is not as pertinent as whether or not you have a plan. If you don't, then you put yourself in the position of having to follow a mentor's plan, and the only reason you'd have to do so is if he is able to prove to you that he is successful, and the only way he can do that is to provide you with tax returns. Good luck with that. Particularly when the mentor is no longer around.

 

A more realistic course is to find a coach. A coach will help you develop a thoroughly-tested and consistently-profitable trading plan of your own, and once it's done, it's yours, to do with as you like, when and where and how you like. If you have no interest in developing such a plan, then you should quit, because you won't be able to succeed without one. If you do have an interest in developing such a plan, the attached will be of help.

 

Be your own coach.

 

Db

Developing A Plan SLAB.pdf

[neeko13 10]

thanks? Lets get back to the topic.Where does one find a mentor, coach, or whatever term you want to use? I dont need cheer leading or encouragement, I would have been my own coach by this point if I could have. I know this is not an easy question but its pretty straightforward if someone has an answer.

[tommyho 10]

I like what Mighty Mouse shared in respect to his example. Evaluation of the market, take in to consideration your assets, affordable risk all good. Would help to have some input from a live person, "No, Edsels are losers." for instance. I've found, there are some Skype chat rooms that have helped me a lot.

[jpennybags 11]

thanks? Lets get back to the topic.Where does one find a mentor, coach, or whatever term you want to use? I dont need cheer leading or encouragement, I would have been my own coach by this point if I could have. I know this is not an easy question but its pretty straightforward if someone has an answer.

 

Obviously... you are not getting the answer that you want to hear. Sorry... and then again... not so much...

 

With all kindness and respect: No one here has provided your answer. Insisting on it won't make it so... just move on. You've spent far to much time insisting that something should happen, which is not going to happen. This may be a reflection of where you are at (eight years out). I can't claim to know... just a thought.

 

If you believe that a mentor is the answer, then by all means... "advance the theatre". It seems to me that there is a way to find that answer, even though it hasn't been found here.

 

Best of good fortune...

[DbPhoenix 42]

thanks? Lets get back to the topic.Where does one find a mentor, coach, or whatever term you want to use? I dont need cheer leading or encouragement, I would have been my own coach by this point if I could have. I know this is not an easy question but its pretty straightforward if someone has an answer.

 

The "term" matters. A coach and a mentor are not the same thing. If you don't know what you want, you won't find it. All you'll end up doing is throwing more money away.

 

If you want to trade somebody else's system and pay them for the privilege, just post notices in all the trading forums. You'll be deluged.

 

Db

[zdo 20]

The "term" matters.

...

 

Neeko,

 

As an exercise maybe define (for yourself) what each of the following are:

Trading Therapy

Trading Training

Trading Coaching

Trading Mentoring

 

If you want, post it. ... some discussion possible...

 

 

zdo

 

PS: chk your PM's

[zdo 20]

When you go through any profile of a ‘great’ trader, make notes of where you and he diverge. One place to run such an exercise is at

 

Almost every time I’ve suggested this exercise, traders come back at me thinking I was saying they should be modeling the other trader - doing it like he does, etc. Nope.

The purpose is to discover your own blind spots - things you have not even considered - not to discover where he or she is doing ‘it’ right and you’re doing ‘it’ wrong.

 

Btw - if you don’t think you have any blind spots then don’t bother with the exercises.

[zdo 20]

Neeko,

 

I think Mark Douglas still lives in AR.

He is no longer actively teaching but he may be willing and able to help you network locally.

 

hth

[neeko13 10]

Thank you Zdo for the constructive and helpful information. Can you PM me his contact info by chance?

[DbPhoenix 42]

I'd like to have that as well, given that he died three months ago . . .

[zdo 20]

RIP Mark [ he aways did favor the mind and ignore the body]

[tommyho 10]

Mentor: A wise and trusted counselor, teacher.

To me, it is an all inclusive term. A mentor has the elements of a coach, teacher, counselor and most of all example. An ideal mentor, allows his mentee, I believe it is spelled, to develop their own strengths and areas of interest - not using the "cookie cutter" approach.

I've found this through APA zones where I've been using their system for 2 yrs now and have participated in their online community through a Skype chatroom. Very helpful and encouraging.