RAVIN

You can increase your odds of not getting stopped out by waiting for a bar to close below the low of the upthrust bar, however in case there is wide range down bar, no point chasing the price there, wait for the price to bounce a little, go down to lower time frame chart and then you may get a chance to enter on a no demand bar, once again, I prefer not to go on market order on the close of the no demand bar, but on the take out of the low of the bar.

Soultrader, Great trade on the Dow, and very sound reasoning, hope you managed to hold through the lunchtime congestion, should be up over 100pts by now;) Tasuki, I have already mentioned Vadym Graifer's book "Techniques of Tape Reading", here it is not about the traditional way of tape reading, it is more in line with Linda Rashcke's definition , you can get her articles from her website. Vadym has outlined 6 principles of supply/demand and created setups and tactics to trade, although the examples focus on intraday trading on stocks, the strategies work in all markets. Some may find it useful, others not, just like MA, RSI, CCI, some swear by it, some swear at it. Regarding Market Delta what I was referring to was your take on bid/ask vol, I presumed it was market delta, if not, fine, then you can post your readings on bid/ask vol with VSA if that provides an extra edge in realtime trades, that way you have a chance to demonstrate the tool and confront any criticisms. By engaging in who is saying what about VSA or bid/ask vol or any other indicator is not going to be productive:roll eyes:

Agreed, infact what Taz has presented actually illustrate 2 of the 6 major supply/demand principles explain in Vadym's book, and in this respect if he has gainfully blended and employed concepts from Market Delta in his realtime trading, then I see no reason why they cannot be posted here. On the theme of decreasing vol on rising prices, upthrust, no demand etc, there were 3 on the Dax this morning. The MA here is not 34EMA but my way of keeping track of what is happening on the 15min chart. that way I do not have to flick back and forth.

Taz, Your contributions are as valuable as the next person, nobody can dictate to you as long as we keep to the core topic of this thread . Any enhancement on that, like the MA you mentioned or Market delta concepts should only be encouraged and not brushed aside. It is also imperative that we move into some realtime trades . When reading from the middle of the chart with the ensuing move in focus, the mind has a tendency to seek all the evidence to validate that and block other countermanding signals, but in realtime we do not have that luxury;) Keep posting pal.

Thanks Tasuki, From the manner of your analysis of the 3 market turns on the chart, it sound very much like VSA and in that respect, both would appear to be two sides of the same coin and hence complementary. However VSA takes into account the spread i.e the range of the bar and the close and ofcourse the background strength/weakness. Would appreciate if you could post some realtime trades. As I mentioned previously I have no problem examining any method which would enhance my trading edge.

Tasuki, I have no problem at evaluating any method of evaluating the supply/demand balance and would enhance VSA reading and my trading edge. With ref. to post 982 following a query by jjtrader,: " Many pages ago on this thread, I recommended an enhancement to VSA in which volume would be broken down into volume up vs volume down. The "experts" on the thread didn't like my idea, but here's an example where it is valuable (in fact, invaluable). See attached chart. On your putative upthrust, the total volume is too high, but just as importantly, the upvolume nearly matches the downvolume (upvolume is seen as a green line inside the wider red line which is downvolume). This clearly shows that there was significant buying on this bar, hence it was not an upthrust. The total volume itself would have been a clue, but the picture is clearer if you separate the up from the down." Based on your observations, I was trying to figure out your recent 5min chart. On the 5.35 bozo (WRB) there appears to be more green then red, as per the indicator on your chart, that would suggest more buying than selling, market forms a double top and reverses. Similar situation exhibits itself on the bars pointed out with a white line. Now I am no expert on up and down vol. but would appreciate if you would clarify the situation for as has been suggested that the only productive and meanifulway way forward is to illustrate these concepts via charts and explanations based on realtime trades. IMHO

Think majority of the successful traders have gone through similar stage, so don't beat yourself on it. You obviously have read Trading in the Zone by Mark Douglas, if not , highly recommended. Also have a look at the attached, from a very successful ex-floor trader, And you are right about information paralysis:doh:, so keep it simple:) Hope this helps TradingPschology.pdf Keep It Simple-DOW.doc

Great to see you here, a close friend "Rak..." talks a lot about your expertise in this field. Besides your daily analysis, your comments and input on posts by others regarding their trade setups etc would be greatly appreciated . Majority would like to learn how to trade with reading VSA. i.e VSA is fine in identifying areas of changes in supply/demand, how can that information be used to determine entries and exits (strategy/tactics).

There you go, meant to say you guys are getting good at this, Get hold of article "Day Trading S&P futures" by Linda Raschke, (on her website), there she mentions a Professional who has made a most enviable living for over 15years by trading just one of these setups and that also trading only in the afternoon (patience) and goes in with size. She says the moral of the story is he knows himself and what style works best for him and he always has a resting stop loss order in the marketplace

You guys are getting at this, nice to see posts getting into strategy and tactics, think have enough of text book hindsight analysis. Great trade execution in the context of immediate previous price action, one can just aim to master a couple of these setups, learn to identify them in realtime, and increase size, you do not need to understand every bar in terms of VSA, will drive you nuts:) Notice you haven't got much response on your post 889, yes it is also an upthrust, a swift markdown in prices followed by an upward drift and a No demand , place to short. However if prices refuse to go down or bars that follow are on low vol, watch out, that is a sign of strength and a potent one at that.

Way to Go, you had the patience to wait for the setup, read it well and sound trade execution, wish there were more posts like yours ,

Which trading platform you use for executing orders on Dax. Do not seem to have problems on Infinity AT platform especially via market orders.

Are there any exchange fees with TransAct Futures or for their trading platform. Market Profile with SC sound good value.

1) Tom William learnt the art of reading the market via Wyckoff and then created his own way of looking at price spread and vol,(no demand, no supply etc) in that respect I would have thought both are two sides of the same coin and complementary. 2) Would appreciate if you would elucidate further as to how a change would be detected , what on the charts would indicate supply swamping demand, or demand drying up, demand overcoming supply etc. I know terms like jumping the creek and breaking the ice or something similar are the terms used in wyckoff.

Interesting correlation with European Markets: Recently the European markets have been leading the US markets, there was a time when it was the other way around, how long this lasts , who knows. Has also been commented upon by some lady traders like Linda Raschke , Nazila Jafari (Top Dax, S&P, Euro trader and a coach, shame she prefers to coach women primarily:rolleyes:, interviewed in http://www.traders-mag.com, Jan 2005) Linda also in one of her interviews states "The Dax is more indicative of Dowtype stocks, while the EuroStoxx is more indicative of the S&Ps and is actually the more active liquid trading contract by about 3 times", she notes, "What you'll find is, if you pull up a 15Min Eurostoxx chart and observe a strong uptrend, I could just by the S&P futures right then and have very high odds of a winning trade" Lets see the Monday 19th Nov action via TT: 1. Wed 14th Nov ---"High to Low" ----- Sell day ?? 2. Thur 15th Nov ---"High to Low" -------SS day 3. Fri 16th Nov ---"Low to High" , close near to open ----Buy day ??? 4, Monday 19th, "Sell day anticipated --- Low to High" On the dax market gaps down , so as per TT, the shorting opportunity would be after a rally, which occurs in the 1st hour and creates a lower high near the previous days High, ideal place to short, the prices then head south for a drop of over a 100 pts. Hence this would conform to TT and would be a Sell Day, 5. This weakness is mirrored right from the open on YM and ES. Now can this be considered not only as a sell day but also one where the Low of the Buy day has been violated, if so what is anticipated for Tuesday, 6. Following the ideal sequency of SS day, buy day, sell day, it should be a SS day or because of that violation of low of Buy day, could it be a buy day i.e test of low, or gap up, sell off, formation of higher low???? Any comments from TT experts here.