Ingot54

Good point TN. I answered this in my own trading life by wising up. The market forces you to wise up, to focus, to discipline yourself into consistency, to stick to the rules you make for yourself, and to work from a plan - and by now I hope that would be a written plan. If you can't be accountable and responsible for the way you conduct your trading, and your results, I seriously don't think anyone else could hold you accountable, and I doubt a spouse would want to. This could be the topic of a new thread. The idea of keeping a journal of trades is good - but it is something I do not do personally. For starters I don't know the kinds of things to be specifically writing about. Perhaps "did I follow my plan" and "what was the outcome?" It would be good if a thread could cover some of the "Journalism of Trading", and include the keeping of charts, what annotations to write on them, and what lessons were learned ... and what kinds of emotions flowed for the duration of the trade. What kinds of information would we be looking for, and how would it be applied to future trades? Negative results upset me, for sure, and I recently wrote as much to a forum member via email. But because I have a plan, I pretty soon bounce back, and it is this that encourages me to plod on.

Brilliant insights there Todds - and I suspect you have a whole lot more to share than this. You have nailed in one post, the essence of the entire thread. Traders are sidetracked too easily - the best indicator, the best market, the best coach, the best system and so on ... until out of frustration, they "see the light" and suddenly it is all about psychology. My contention is that it is NOT. The pathway to success in trading may be to stabilise on ONE instrument, focusing the strategy in a way that matches the personality of the trader, until the strategy is mastered. The worst development in the world, has been the invention of instant coffee, if you grasp my meaning! To continue the sporting analogy - it is like an athlete who moves from track-and-field to tennis. If he doesn't make it there, he moves to baseball, then to football, golf, swimming, basketball and then switches back to tennis. All the while, he fails to focus on any single sport for long enough to master the finer details that might have made him a champion. Instant gratification in other aspects of life may work for a time - but as an approach ot trading it is guaranteed to fail. There is no quick road to success in trading. Nothing can replace the experience of screen time, and more screen time. I imagine Roger Federer watches the replays of his own games, as well as the games of his opponents, when planning a strategy for an up-coming match. He will not be watching a replay of his game against Lleyton Hewitt when he is to face Rafael Nadal. His focus will be on the strong and weak points of NADAL - how he handled the characteristics of his other opponents would be reserved for another day. It does not help a trader to be attempting to trade the GBPJPY for the first time, when he normally only trades the EURAUD. The two are chalk and cheese, and require separate skills to manage them (imv). In order to obtain the skill-set necessary to handle trading, one must be prepared to focus on the instrument traded, and perhaps even more specifically, one or two of the individual component entities within that Instrument group. There will always be the exception - but if a trader wants to develop the skills, there is no other way that to focus, and specialise. As you pointed out, Todds - it is about Technical Proficiency ... an edge ... Not too many traders trade successfully without at least knowing the trend, or the range, regardless of the other aspects of TA.

FXGirl I humbly thank you for your generous response. The way you have phrased your points can not be reproached, and when I think over my own path, I have to say that your illustration of why "one size does NOT fit all" has caused me to reflect quite a bit on this issue. While my illustration of cutting apron strings does serve a purpose - eg getting traders to think about 'blaming' as opposed to 'learning'; 'focus' instead of 'flippancy' and 'determination' instead of 'depression' - I am compelled to agree with you that not all traders come under such a broad umbrella. While I do not wish to attack any individual, or their personal business model or practice - to do so would be quite unfair from the hidden cover of a nomme de plume - my rant is designed to wake traders up to the reality that trading is, and move them from their collective backsides (in as gentle a way as possible, which is impossible). For too long I was just like the traders I describe - looking for the next best thing - scouring the Internet, forums and so on, downloading indicators (some of which I have retained) and even purchased 5 systems from reputable people - all good. That alone paints a picture of me - searching, but expecting the answer to be outside of myself. Then it hit me - "stop looking for a crutch - start looking at your own trades." (I can not say why "it hit me" - perhaps it was as a result of 7 years of serious study of all that I can find written about trading - don't know.) From there it was just a matter of writing down what I do, and then the realisation came that I was not even able to stick to my own written rules. Indeed, I discovered my own impulsivity, based on many things eg a desire to be in a trade when there was none, and kidding myself that what I was doing was "based on my rules!" What I described is what I call "coming to the end of my tether" or, "being disgusted with my approach and attitude." So while I may come across as belligerent on this, the truth is that I have not long discovered the breakthrough - thus my desire to foist the idea on others who also struggle. I want to shake traders free, to cause them to look within at their reasons for not taking responsibility - rather than looking to a psychologist as a first stop on their shopping list, and instead, actually do what Fajim2004 did, and APPLY a written strategy. Whether anyone actually takes it on board or not - I may never know - I hope they do, because it is one very powerful "fix" for many of the issues besetting troubled traders. On the other hand - you have unraveled me a little with your rationality - indeed I do see that there are more ways to skin a cat. It may yet transpire that my way is not the panacaea, or the efficacious approach. Trading is indeed complex, and I agree there is no universal approach that is tailored to all persons. But I have to stick to my assertion, that unless certain things are attended to, out of a sense of responsibility, no amount of hand-holding by coaches or others, will address the need. With regard to your question above - I first read the statistic in about 2005 I think, and saved this link from that discussion: http://www.travismorien.com/FAQ/trading/futradersuccess.htm The author quotes 4 studies that allude to the statistic holding up. More than that I am unable to define a source. PS - I congratulate you for belonging to the top 5%. I think I am at about 6% but I am aiming for the top 2% ... whatever that means!

Well done Fajim2004, on taking the initiative, and following through with a plan. That is exactly what I advocate - HAVING A PLAN ... and having it WRITTEN DOWN so that there can be NO room for bias, second guessing, or taking trades that are NOT in the scope of the plan. As for your "Paths to Consistency" Seminar, I have no opinion, because I have not attended it. I would be interested though, in due course, to hear back from you about how you found the course - and how your trading is going 3 months after completing the seminar. I do not know - you might be well on your way to financial independence by then, and indeed "trading for a living." Just one 2 1/2 day workshop @ $600 may be all anybody needs. It seems to be excellent value compared to the many thousands charged by other professionals. I have not heard any feedback from anyone who has actually completed this seminar, so I might be missing something. Maybe your results will be what is required to convert me to the idea that a single workshop can turn traders from loss-to-profit. However, my original contention still stands - here are the rhetorical questions I pose: * Can any course substitute for a trader taking responsibility for their own trading results? * Can a trader succeed without having a written trading plan? * Is the absence of a written trading plan the "missing link" ? * Does the "Support Industry" (set up to service the failing trader) really have the answers, given the so-called statistical failure rate of traders as 95% ? * Can the inability of traders to breakthrough and truly "trade for a living" be addressed by one $600 - $3500 - $7000 - course? * Is the true value of the material received by the trader reflected in the cost? * Can a trader really help themselves, through the application of home-grown and common garden consistency? * Do traders coming into the industry really understand what "trading for a living" involves, and what kind of life "trading for a living" will actually deliver to them? *Do would-be traders entering the industry possess the personality attributes and risk profile, suited to speculating in financial markets? And some non-rhetorical questions: * Why do 95% of would-be traders fail to reach their goals, and indeed leave the industry with disappointment and busted accounts? * Why have these statistics stood for so long, given the massive support industry available to traders? * Are "psychological issues" the real reason traders are failing? (I think that one is rhetorical ) ... and my favorites: * Whatever happened to common sense? * Why is it traders can take responsibility for mowing the lawn, and paying the utility bills, but won't take responsibility for their own trading activity? * Why do traders think that if they just get the right entry/strategy/system and so on, that they will over come their problems with losing? Could it be that this is what is fed to them by an industry with a vested interest in keeping them thinking that? * Why do traders take expensive courses, and attend expensive sessions with "counselors and coaches" (which I did to no avail) instead of trying the easy things, like writing out a strict approach, based on rules and situations? * Why do traders jump from Equities to Indices, to Forex to Futures. eMinis, Options, and then try to scalp, then swing trade, then try another system and so on, instead of FOCUSING and COMMITTING to a WRITTEN PLAN with DETERMINATION and CONSISTENCY? Fajim2004 The above was not specifically addressed to you, and is not personal. It is a general summary of the general situation that exists across the trading industry. For you to take the seminar with Mark Douglas is a commendable thing. My only comment about attending such a seminar, is that you must already have failed to make the breakthrough by following your written plan, and been unable to focus on your traded instrument to the required degree. "Failing to make a breakthrough" is not something to hide or be ashamed of - I am certain 100% of traders have experienced this, and many are STILL suffering it. "Doing something about it", on the other hand IS something to be proud of. I look forward to your feedback - perhaps my rigidity on this issue can be bent.

Stuck on the DPP @ 1.0003. looks like this down-trend is strong enough to break through, but parity is a tough nut to crack! I'm off to bed - usually don't get too excited about Mondays. No data on AUD until 10.30am local time Tuesday morning. That is 7.30pm Monday evening GMT. There is not expected to be much hawkish news released from the Monetary Policy Meeting Minutes, given that Australia was in the grip of its cyclical floods and bushfires when the meeting was held. The recovery effort locally does NOT need noises from the RBA, and the housing data was positive, though weak, so no need to scare the woodies with jawboning this time round. Anyway - I will be more interested in the markets in 18 hours time - after the knee-jerks have done their thing, and the real trends begin to show. Right now there is nothing steering the currencies - it is INDEED meanderings! The only thing I noted was that the EURO lost one cent today, which explains USD strength, and the deterioration of the AUD at the moment. Cheers

That is a bit absurd, and I don't recall alluding to anything like that. That was from the third paragraph of my FIRST post to the thread. I am unsure if you read all my posts' date=' or just skimmed through picking up points of contention. But I seem to recall purposely mentioning that these have their place. What my point is, in all of this thread, is that there is [u']AN ENTIRE INDUSTRY[/u] feeding off the hopes and fears of people who should never be involved in trading in the first place, and that as Psychologists, Authors, Coaches, mentors, those folks have a DUTY and RESPONSIBILITY to weed these out from the outset. I could argue a VERY good case for the intervention of Psychologists, and you could have done this better than I can, but I'll take a shot at it: 1) Psychologists are best suited to assess the mental aptitude of an aspiring trader, and advise accordingly whether to stick to the Cello lessons, or get stuck into trading financial markets. I would put this assessment into the class of "Trading Personality Profile". 2) Psychologists could offer serious guidance to would-be traders, concerning their RISK PROFILE, attitudes to speculation, money, loss, and whether the trader truly grasps what "Trading for a Living" really involves. The images of Yachts and Ferarri's should be long gone before a would-be trader ever gets near a chart. Someone has to tell it like it is - to separate the dreams from the reality.

Human nature being what it is, we naturally form opinions, biases, prejudices and so on, and we like to generalize and stereotype just about everything. We like to C-O-N-T-R-O-L our environment, and so the tendancy exists to slot everything into its own little pigeon-hole. Then we relax - the business is done. Nice. But you can not pigeon-hole the markets like this. For starters, you may think that you can REMEMBER all your rules, and just by looking at a chart, you "know" where the trade needs to be entered and closed. But ... somewhere the trade goes wrong, and when you check back over your WRITTEN plan, you discover that you went ahead and entered BEFORE price pulled back to support/resistance/Pivot Point and so on. Why does this happen? Because, as mentioned, we look at a chart, and form an unconscious bias about it, and simply overlook the one rule that disagrees with this unconscious bias. You do NOT need a $7,000 course in trading, or the current #1 Best Seller book on Trading Psychology to "fix" your problem. All you need to do, is to write out your $#@%$ rules and be done with it. Get committed to following a plan CONSISTENTLY and you can pretty much be done with the rest. As mentioned, here is a list of "required reading" for you to come up to speed with the idea of having a written trading plan. The idea is to become familiar with whatever has gone before, and to become familiar with the reasons other traders have, for understanding the need to have WRITTEN trading rules, strategy, money management, entries and exits, and in fact 'everything in one box' so that there can be NO doubt as to your complete approach to your trading activities. Not sure how far this will get - it will depend on YOUR input as much as mine. Feel free to bring ANY ideas you may have to the table, and we will put them all into the mix and sort out their place. Read on ... 1. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f37/following-your-plan-8910.html 2. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f43/trading-plan-roadmap-trading-markets-449.html 3. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f30/define-your-trading-plan-7312.html 4. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f30/trading-plan-101-a-4988.html 5. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f30/trading-plan-development-help-input-please-4846.html 6. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f104/constructing-candlestick-trading-plan-2210.html 7. http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f37/trading-plan-self-psychology-1943.html There are others, but not really appropriate to what we want to discuss here. So ... after reading through the links (however briefly) ... what are YOUR ideas about the elements of a Trading Plan?

It is quite apparent to me, and probably to you too, that a statistically significant number of traders have NEVER produced their own WRITTEN Trading Plan ... who knows the numbers. But something has to be done to straighten out the situation that currently exists, that traders can simply throw five hundred bucks into an account, and begin trading, without having even a remote inkling that they are ill-prepared to be even participating in the financial markets. It is possible to become so excited by the lure of "Trading for a Living" offered by the thousands of Internet Marketeers, that would-be traders lose their reason. All you have to do is download a trading platform, answer a few questions the right way: eg "Do you understand the Risks associated with the use of leveraged Instruments?" and you can fund a live account, often with a 10% bonus thrown in "to get you started." This should be made a criminal offense, but this is a free world, and if the Dudes want so much to be separated from their money - there are thousands of "dealers" lined up to oblige. Given that we can not regulate against stupidity, the next best thing to do is enlighten would-be traders about their folly. It is not possible to do all that in one article - and I am not sure I would want to anyway. But on this forum there have been numerous requests for help, in one way or another, that are so far unrequited, and clearly one aspect CAN be addressed with little fuss. I intend to discuss "Elements of a Trading Plan" as we go along. At the end of this discussion, I hope we can together construct most of the elements needed (as mandatory) so that traders CAN write out a workable plan. I do not intend to "give" you that plan. WHY NOT? Because unless you, the trader, are emotionally tied to your own WRITTEN plan, you might as well not have it. It will be pointless. You will see it as just a set of guidelines, and NOT as the rigid, set-in-stone 'Commandments' they truly need to be. Look - think of your plan as a new girl-friend, for want of a better analogy. First you go through the flirting stage as you get to know each other. You become used to her nuances, the way she reacts to certain circumstances, and you begin to understand the things that make her anxious, and the things that she is comfortable with. Over time you decide that you quite like her, and it becomes obvious that you are falling in love. What is happening is that you are becoming bonded to her emotionally, as you discover that you both share so much in common. Eventually you are convinced that you really can't function too well without her, so you decide to become engaged, planning to marry. Nice little picture. But that is EXACTLY what you are doing with your trading plan - you are nurturing it, and you become so happy with it, that you can not trade without it. You don't wish to offend your girlfriend - so don't do it to your trading plan. To avoid offending the rules, the best way is to have them written down. Yet out of 100 traders, you could probably find only a small number - perhaps five or maybe ten - (who really knows for sure?) - have any rules written down, and even then, such rules might only be rough guidelines. In the next post, I will include links to all the threads on Traders Laboratory which have discussion about trading plans. Please read them - even briefly - before we continue.

You could try the Financial Services Ombudsman in Australia. http://fos.org.au/centric/home_page.jsp and go to the toolbar link: "RESOLVING DISPUTES" I took my case against my bank to them in 2008 and after a couple of letters back and forth - a few offers by them to us which we rejected, - we eventually received not only full compensation, but a waiver of several hundred dollars of fees. I also had a case against one of those Internet Marketing scams that you get introduced to through "free" seminars. (2009). We did everything required of us, but could NOT get the support promised to us. The emails went back and forth, until our warranty time ran out, leaving the situation unresolved, and the company claimed they no longer had any obligation to us, as the time had expired. However, because we were in dispute BEFORE the expiry of that warranty time, and THEY had NOT provided appropriate support, as per the Warranty, the decision went in our favour, and we received a full refund of the $$ we paid for the course. The tactic is to stall, or to try to put it back onto the client - to show that the client had NOT fulfilled all the requirements as per the agreement. These people are only sharks that have the experience to tie people in knots with promises, linked to empty warranties. Do not hold back from hitting them hard and fast with everything you can. I found that the mere mention of blabbing on every forum in Australia about our case brought very swift reaction from those at the very top of the company - and the matter was resolved speedily. We knew we were on good ground, because I had filed EVERY email contact, and made diary entries of the date and substance of my phone calls to the company. I was able to set out everything in a time line, and as facts. There was nothing subjecting, and it was a complete and objective record of what had happened. You have to present it factually, no emotional rubbish from you - just facts, times, details. No one wants to hear "They said I would make $1million". What they want to see is that "The company told us in paragraph 7(b) that with their support, it was possible to become financially independent over time" ... or ... "The seminar speaker told us that 'Mr X of Bondi Beach' had made $40,000 in 6 months by following their plan with their support, and you can too, with their 'Gold Plan.' We decided, after listening to similar stories of success, and seeing the promises of guidance and support, and the 90 day money back guarantee, 'no questions asked' that this was something we could do." This is the kind of thing you need to tell the Ombudsman. You also need to have corresponded with the company, requesting your refund for the same reasons. The Ombudsman will see that it was the support and money-back guarantee that has been dishonored, and you *should* win your case. Build your case on facts. You have to have solid evidence that they did not perform their promise as stipulated either verbally, or in the written warranty. We no longer go to these Wealth Creation seminars, of course, but I always made it a habit of becoming friendly with other attendees, who were previously unknown to me, and I would find one who was willing to "keep in touch" and exchange mobile numbers etc. You can always call on these people then as witnesses to what was promised by "Speaker X' because there is invariably a huge difference between what the Speakers say, and what the Warranty says. The most common way they default, is on the promise of "Full Support". Best of luck with it. Persist. Know your facts. Have records handy, and write down the substance of phone conversations, times, dates, who you spoke to and the outcome. When unsure (they will attempt to confuse you by twisting facts and circumstances) do not agree to anything - remember, YOU are the one complaining. Do not let it twist to YOU being the one NOT performing what they asked you to. Do NOT back down or concede anything - these people are so slippery that they can remove your socks without disturbing your shoes!

Thank you for that Paul. I will get to this point eventually. The way you put it sounds so easy ... Just 2 burned demo accounts and you are there!! I am just kidding - I realise you were illustrating a way to quickly learn how to use VSA - and I am grateful. Next thing is a starting point. Currently I have the 2 .PDF docs that are stickies at the top of the menu ... and they are quite readable for me. Other starting reading is also welcome. Cheers.

Just catching up with this again ... pushed to the back burner, but it doesn't deserve to be lost. I agree with your assessment of the way to learn this, Intel. When something is handed to you on a platter, it is so easy to treat it lightly, or even dismiss it. But when the SAME info is earned through your own sweat and tears, suddenly the info has value and meaning. That is what I want VSA to mean to me - something valuable and usable. For the moment, I will be moving slowly with this, as I am wanting to continue to develop my trading the way I am. But I imagine at some point I will be compelled to make the switch. Thank you for the encouragement.

Siuya This is the kind of rare insight that must "grow" on a trader, or else he must sit down beside a benevolent trader who already understand the gyrations of the markets, and if he is hungry, he will feed from it. In my own situation, I am a one-show-pony with my trading. I have a plan and I have a strategy to execute that plan. Doesn't always come together but there is a little box in my written plan that says "set Stop Loss at x times ATR when trading the XXX.XXX in the X time frame". All I do is take my setups - time after time - banging away at the market every time it is there. It works, and that's that. All my job is, is to manage the trades then. A better trader might still be in the market while I am out (waiting for another setup). Eventually I will "get it" too, but the "edge" in trading isn't taught in a book. It will come through screen time and paying attention. 5,000,000 traders, from Indonesia to India, China to the USA, already have the same edge from the text-book. I have to be ahead of them if I am trying to take something off the table. Only the points you mentioned as attributes of Pro Traders have a chance of delivering the edge ... passion, work ethic, flexibility, questioning mind. These should be the natural tools of the trading mind. And the benefits of "being" this type of trader is that when the opportunity comes to grasp something new, you will be ready emotionally, because you are hungry for it. Less than this and you might as well read books all day, as attempt to trade. The dog just won't hunt unless he's hungry.

This is at the heart of my lament about the Coaching industry. Now we are on common ground - the DESIRE to change MUST be an EMOTIONAL one - driven by a need to remove the pain of recurring negative outcomes. I was unaware from a reading of your site' date=' that you do offer these ... and I applaud you for that. At which stage are these "free consults" applicable ... before the commitment to commence a course ... or after the student has completed a section of a course for which they have already paid something? I have no issue with that at all - but what brings the student to that point? I contend that NO COURSE or COUNSELLING can make a student ready for something, for which they are currently emotionally unprepared. The studentMUST be at a crisis point within before any course, book, seminar and so on will transmit ANY knowledge or behaviour change. The above are just my views. I have been involved in raising children, and caring for prison inmates, whose only desire in life is to manipulate their way through the day. The desire to manipulate is even stronger than the desire for freedom. Indeed, many inmates do not desire freedom as a primary goal. Rather, it is status and success in manipulation that they get off on. Traders who have not made the "bid for freedom" are still in the "manipulative phase" of their growth as a trader, and retain a desire for "mothering-and-hand-holding" as opposed to tackling the problem at its root, and getting off their derrieres and responsibly working on a plan.

Thanks Simon – I do accept what you are saying, and in fact I do see the things I am bagging as a part of the puzzle. But only as part of the puzzle – they are NOWHERE near the SOLUTION. What I am trying to do is define the problem, and that is that there is an entire industry that sucks the blood from traders, as it purports to hold their hands … for the price of a book … Seminar … Course … and so on. And I lament loudly that NONE of these things really is of ANY benefit to a trader who just wants someone to hold their hand. Now please do NOT take this the wrong way – I am NOT against personal mentorship, or personal coaching. What I am against is an industry which is supposed to be changing the way traders approach trading, with the promise of a breakthrough, yet the perpetual result is only more of the same. I believe there IS good material “out there” but it is NOT accessible to “ordinary” retail traders. And as much as Professionals and Authors want to promote their methods and their success rates through “testimonials” the truth of the matter is that right here on this forum we have perhaps 100 traders (think of a number and double it ) who are also crying out for some one to be REAL with them - someone to cut to the chase and debunk the BS that is put out ad nauseum. Your own experience as a teacher of other traders (and I sincerely applaud your goodwill in doing that) illustrates exactly what I am saying.: that only those who have no other vested interest than the advancement of their protégé will be divulging much of applicable use to anyone. There are those who churn “market-speak” for its own sake, and make a very good living off the back of struggling traders who seek out their services. In the end, such traders risk finding themselves many thousands of dollars lighter in the hip-pocket, but really still clueless about why their account is still static or falling. I doubt ANY trader will ever find success in this field, without having a structured approach as mentioned earlier, and the inner DRIVE and DESIRE to crash … or crash through. If you read Wikipedia and search for “Battle of Fýrisvellir”, read further on Styrbjörn, who burned his ships to force his men to fight to the end. While this stuff my or may not be myth – the anecdote does have an application in trading. The lesson is that is you wish to succeed, you have to be so committed, that you will do whatever is necessary to achieve that. Simon, I am not attempting to discount what you are saying – I sincerely support your view. But you said yourself, that " ... that was before I had another real rough patch where I learned some hard lessons. In the end, it was my experience and rough patches that made me the trader I am ... " And that is my point - YOU did it YOURSELF after YOU had been through your rough patch. No one held your hand, as much as you might have cried out for that help. Success can and does rest on the many steps and “aha!” moments that come to us in our search for answers. But my contention is that is will not depend on the multi-thousand-dollar course or weekend events, or sessions with someone who is attempting to surgically excise the “please-mother-me” emotional ties that prevent advancement, and independent responsibility for action. The emotions will not heal until the trader wants them to, and that point will not be reached until they cry: “Enough!”

Some very good responses and ideas expressed here. Thank you. I don’t recall that test' date=' TradeRunner, which means I didn’t do it. I concede I may have viewed things a little differently had I taken the trouble to apply myself and participated in the spirit of the book at that time. I read the book first in 2005 from memory, and again maybe 2006, but was not influenced enough at that stage to apply anything Mark Douglas was saying. Same with my Van K Tharpe book … I sold all of my trading books … 35 books in all, and kept one - recommended here: http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f18/must-read-list-9251.html (see post #6) But let me say this: I had done personality tests, risk profiles earlier in that year (2005) with (Coach) Chris Shea, and these things were already occupying my thoughts – I think I ignored similar exercises (if that was what it was about) for that reason at the time. I am open enough to admit that I may have seriously overlooked something then that may have influenced me for the better. I may never know – and I am pretty much immune to purchasing books now – it’s all been said in one form or another. The next book I read will be one I write myself – and I can promise you – if I ever do – it will not be a “please go softly, don’t break me” effort. It will have the bones laid bare, and I would seriously destroy what I see as the problems within the trading literature and teaching/learning industry. I won’t go much further than to say I have little respect for the trading support industry as a whole – and that includes those who push the pedal on the Psychological “healing” approach to trading. These folk are making seriously good money “helping” traders overcome bad habits. I remain fixed in my beliefs that if you have psychological issues, psychological assistance will not be your answer. The only thing I know that overcomes a bad experience is to get out there and get yourself roughed up – not as a masochist, but as a student – and L-E-A-R-N what works. If you can NOT apply the principles of successful trading, then you have [u']NO BUSINESS TRADING IN FINANCIAL MARKETS[/u] – you will get destroyed. Let me repeat – break the rules and pay the price. You have to cut the cord with “your mother” and imv Psychological coaching is a surrogate mother. At the end of the therapy, will you remember what the course/therapy taught? I think probably very little of it. What does teach us, is our emotional experiences, and pain, elation, frustration and so on. If you keep on doing what you always did, you will keep on getting what you always got. Stop it. Make the DECISION to change, and DO IT. I can not see that traders need more than to be consistent and committed, and follow all the things I listed in my earlier posts. You have to read everything I am saying full context of the thread. Please read what I am NOT saying too. I will elaborate in my next post and in replies to others who have also been kind enough to respond. Sorry for the long response, TradeRunner - with me you can't get the short answer when the long answer is an option!

Thank you for your very nice sentiments JH. The truth is that I am just one very fed up trader too. I got to the stage where I knew that I can trade successfully but was constantly sabotaging my accounts by taking trades that were well outside my own rules. It doesn't get any more pathetic than that, I can tell you. I can tell you one thing though - I never stop asking questions and seeking out the things that successful traders do, that is different from what I do. You know what? There is very little to be changed.. So far all I have been able to discover is that other traders who I believe ARE successful, have different systems and trade different markets and different time frames, but they STILL have to deal with the SAME issues that I deal with. So ... what to do? The answer is not going to be found in a seminar, or a book, or a coaching session - that sticks out like the dog's credentials. If the answers WERE found in those things, then most traders WOULD already be successful, because word would soon get around that a certain coach, course, book, seminar ext was the answer, and traders would be lined up nine deep to get that information for themselves. They are not. The book sellers/coaches go to #1 for a year, then drop into obscurity - only to surface when someone suddenly remembers "oh, that is a good book ... course ... coach". The truth is, 99% of what the coach said, or what was heard at the seminar/webinar, or what was in the book, is forgotten on Monday morning, and the other 1% is never applied with zest. We part with $39.95 for a book; $2,000 for a seminar; $3k to $7k for a coach. And are we better traders for it? Look - I have to get right back to my original point here - all these things are props ... hand-holding. In my analogy, they are "your mother" standing by to rescue you. I have news for all those who fit that picture - your mother can't trade. She is not going to help you on this one - even if she wanted to. Trading is NOT for boys - it is for those who have learned to stand on their own feet, and take responsibility for the necessary learning, planning, commitment and discipline (consistent application of the plan) that is required to make a trade come together. There is nothing much more to it than that. I do not like to waste my time or anyone else's with BS - anything I post is designed to take others forwards, or bring myself closer to an understanding of something lacking in myself. Even my blog - taken as the exercise that it was - was a confirmation to myself of what is necessary. The things I have written in this thread, and in the one in the link in post #3, is as serious and as genuine as I can get. I can not put it any more plainly - you will learn to trade well when you are ready to do what is necessary to win. I have listed ALL of the requirements. I can trade successfully myself, but I still seek a further edge to lift my trading to the wildly successful level I know I can achieve, and which I know is waiting for me. I WILL succeed in this - nothing can stop me. I have it in my bile, my gut, my waking and sleeping moments, and in the time I spend reading and writing on forums. I have a desire to bring struggling traders along with me, and that is why I write the way I do. No one has to know or understand my background, but I can tell you there are things that cause us to crash, or crash through. Do you have any of that? If you do, then you WILL get there mate. Do not give up.

A few of the above points were probably covered in this thread: http://traderslaboratory.com/forums/f37/psychological-self-help-budget-challenged-trader-9208.html But the point of THAT thread is that for things to change, YOU have to be FED UP with your current situation. The Youtube clips on posts #3 and #6 have a VERY powerful message - ONLY when you are SO disgusted with your situation ... when you are totally at your limit of frustration ... when you are on the point of giving up, or breaking through, will you find the drive to do what you HAVE to do. Take responsibility for the silly ( a euphemism for something more vernacular) trading decisions that are repeated trade after trade, and STOP what you are doing, until you FIX what is wrong. If you can't objectively look at my first post in this thread, and identify even ONE factor that you could really do something about this weekend, then I doubt you are serious about ever making money in this game. I can tell you that I have some issues to overcome - and one of them is ... IMPULSE! The way I overcame that, is to follow my written trading plan. You can NOT enter an impulse trade if you are following a trading plan to the letter. If you ignore the plan, and just trade on hunch ... just once ... then you are NOT READY to succeed at trading ... and perhaps you might be better spending your time working on a lotto plan! How many times have we heard that the trading world is full of sharks ... that we are trading against other VERY smart traders ... that we can not win every trade ... that draw down is a big part of every trade ... and so on. yet despite all those warnings, we have traders who fail to have a written plan, and who persist in trading instruments, time frames and markets, in an under-capitalized state, with too much leverage, and then complain that they can't make trading pay. Yep. The idea of this thread is that you have to cut the strings with your mother. She is NOT going to show you how to trade. Trading is NOT a boys game. You have to get to a point where you show you have the 'nads to succeed. Persistence, passion, patience, perception, are all good things to possess, but totally useless if, in the final execution of the trade, you fail to observe all the preparation that has gone before. Success is finally up to YOU.

Yes - I agree with your view on direction, Mystic. The last 4 candles on 15M are red now, and this has sent Stochastic into a steepish dive, as well as MACD. In fact all systems are saying "sell" ... except for one tiny detail - the S1 PP. Right now price has come within 7 pips of the S1 PP on at least 6 occasions, and is beginning to set up a consolidation base, of sorts. If the current run (over the past hour) at the S1 fails, then a mini rally may occur, in keeping with your view of a "small pop up". But I would not become too enthused about any rally just yet - this push down has legs, and Bears will not allow any rally to get out of hand - just my view. Once the S1 is defeated, the solid bearish trend *should* resume. This is just a pause. But as always - keep an open mind - the best money is made through getting into reversals at an early point. We are currently right in the middle of some VERY solid support, and I expect tough going before any correction can proceed. The most likely scenario is for sideways movement from here ... let's see how it pans out.

Every time I hear someone recommend a good trading book - out trot the old chestnuts ... Mark Douglas, Van K Tharpe, Brett Steenbarger, Janice Dorn, Curtis faith, Rick Bookstabber and even Jack Schwager ... all come out as "the best book I ever read" ... or ... "the book I would recommend first." But do these books really make a difference? Can anything we read really make a difference to how we approach trading? Is the "Psychology of Trading" a legitimate therapy for traders, or just a convenient add-on, taken up by Psychologists and Psycho=therapists who want to cash in on yet another field ripe for the picking? I have certainly read my share of good books - and I have even recommended a few at times too. But I am yet to meet one trader whose trading success is down to the efforts of Psychological intervention in their approach to trading. Sure, there are those who swear by NLP, but there are also those who have received zero assistance from this therapy too. And I can tell you that through my 2 readings of each of "Trading in the Zone" and "Trade Your Way to Financial Freedom", I have to say that I can not, today, remember any single piece of instruction from either, that has lifted my trading to another level. I think it might be time to take a second look at this industry. We are so indoctrinated these days to think - "It's not your fault. You were emotionally damaged as a child. You need to have some therapy to deal with your demons, and then you will be fine," that we lose sight of the fact that real men have "true grit". Think about it - did your daddy or your mummy solve their head problems through going to a shrink ... reading books, 230 sessions with a psychologist? ... or did they just get on with it, and knuckle down and deal with things as they came? Look, I am not saying that there are not real cases where issues of confidence or procrastination, impulse and so on can be helped by having someone more experienced to bounce ideas off. Of course such situations exist, and of course professionals might have some sort of role in that. But for goodness sakes, why do we always tend to blame our damaged psychology every time we stuff it up in executing our trades? It's wrong, in my view. And to put it as bluntly as I can, I think it is time traders found some balls. It is time to accept responsibility for our own failure to maintain commitment and consistency - otherwise known as (you guessed it - the most clichéed and least understood word in trading) ... D-I-S-C-I-P-L-I-N-E. Face it - if you can not handle the markets you trade, then it is probably likely that you lack a half-proper trading plan, strategy, money management and strict WRITTEN rules. Or you are attempting to trade with insufficient capital, too much leverage, the wrong instrument for your personality and risk profile, or the wrong timeframe. Have you EVER seriously looked at those issues, instead of running off to read the latest "self-help" guru's offering? I'll wager right now that 95% of traders on this site do NOT have a Written Trading Plan ... a number that strangely coincides with the same number of traders that fail to make any profits in the markets!! The next thing a mature trading approach might call for, is to study ONE instrument, in ONE time frame and MASTER that single entity, before attempting to move on to other situations. What I am getting at here, is that we really need to STOP navel-gazing, and STOP wondering if there is some elusive demon driving our trading decisions. Instead, why not spend some time actually getting to really KNOW the market you are attempting to trade, and stop being like a butterfly and jumping from one bright flower to the next. Stop hoping that the trading idea of the century is just one more system/strategy/signal service/indicator or different instrument away. You mother doesn't trade - stop expecting someone to do it all for you. Get some cojones and get serious about some decent learning effort. Stop the wishing and the yearning. Learn to master your market. Now there's a good topic for a book!

Well interesting development in AUD ... We did indeed see respect of the DAILY S3 level, 1.0014 (actual 1.0009) followed by a rally back to the WEEKLY PP, 1.0063 (actual 1.0065). So these PP's have truly established their TA worth in this 4H environment. Activity that followed: A drop to the earlier support of 1.0030 (actual 1.0028) and a rebound to the DAILY S2 1.0051 (actual 1.0052). The open/close level of 1.0038 established itself as a new turning point/support/resistance over the course of 4 x 4H candles, and should be remembered as a zone of interest for the future. The current candle has bounced off resistance at 1.0030 and now looks to have broken down below the DAILY S3 PP. This roughly coincides with a burst through parity (1.0000) which seems to be losing the respect it previously held as a psychological level of S & R. We have a new 4H candle due now, and in the absence of significant PP's in the vicinity, we will need to be guided by price action of the lower TF. The next support - S1 - occurs on the 1H TF @ 0.9963, and S2 @ 0.9913. Getting back to the WEEKLY TF ... the bounce off 0.9978 is still within the support zone, but in light of the strong downtrend, this zone appears increasingly vulnerable. We would need to begin to see signs of consolidation at the current "peri-parity" zone, if indeed a rally is to eventuate before the end of the week's trading. (Refer to the WEEKLY chart in my post above.)

Have a look at my posts #11 & #12 ... exactly the same thing happened to me, so I feel I am in good company! Speaking of learning things ... one of the things that has really made a difference to my survival in trading, was to stop looking at charts and thinking ... no ... this CAN"T be a turning point - the indicators are still saying the trend will continue. But that's the rub with this game - the best of our indicators are late to the party, and although I think a better term than "lagging" could be coined, the facts are that our indicators can not alert us to situations where the market turns on a dime. The best indicators then, are our eyes, and our experience. Right now, the 4H looks to be putting in a pin-bar , and if my earlier assessment of the Weekly chart is near the money, then this *could* turn out to be the bottom of the current down-trend. Last time I said that, I had to eat a very large slice of humble pie - the market simply dislikes being told what it is going to do! But rather than trying to predict, we are really in the business of being aware of possible scenarios, and then being prepared to act when any of the events comes to pass. The bottom line here, is to be rigid in your application of your rules, and take EVERY setup that your rules tell you to. After that, the rest is management of the trade. To pre-empt the market is to risk missing some very juicy trades indeed.

The WEEKLY chart is very interesting right now. The trend is still strongly UP ... but ... there is a bit of conflict on the indicators (mine). MTF Stochastic is happy to confirm a rally is still in place, but MACD is showing divergence indicating weakness in the trend. imho this is understandable (MACD) because of the consolidation ocurring on the weekly chart. Since October 2010 (a period of just 5 months) the AUUSD has been up arounf this all time high no less than 6 times now. And since Christmas day, there has been NO price breach the 1.0252 high. That bit was included to show WHY the MACD is tracking down - momentum is slackening right off. BUT ... the uptrend still remains the go. At the moment there are 2 possibilities with the weekly candle: 1) It will bounce from here, which is the 50% retrace level of last weeks nice green candle. Current price is also SUPPORT - around 1.0020 +/- 40 pips, forming a zone of support right now. As with all zones, price can penetrate wherever it likes, briefly, and then bounce to respect that zone. I can see three reasons, therefore (including Stochastic) to support a rally from here. 2) It will continue to retrace, ignoring support, and dip back through parity. The MACD is alluding to this as likely, and given that price can not remain static, or even (narrowly) range-bound for too long, It may just be that the MACD will be correct in its indication. What we need to see in the AUDUSD (opinion only ... usually flawed) is momentum gathering. Right now, the Fundamentals are not supporting a tearaway rally. I hesitate to bring Fundamentals in to my charting considerations, because on the lower TF we trade what we see, not what we think. But on the higher TF like Weekly and Monthly (which I do not trade ... yet) you can not afford to ignore the economic story. To complicate that view, the markets have not traded on Fundamentals for nearly 2 years - it's either "risk-on" or "risk-off" and lately it is "risk-on" regardless of the news! Traders buy the USD when the news is good, and they buy it when news is bad ... go figure! Safe-haven ... or gambling? So all of this can only ever be taken with a grain of rock-salt! Eventually the serious money will show up in the weekly trend, and that's why I have brought this into the picture right now - we are at a watershed 50% retrace, coupled with support going back to October last year. We have to spot the higher trends, imv, and trade the lower TF with these trends in mind. Would be happy to hear the views of others on this approach. It helps me to see whether there is any grunt left in this down-trend, or we are about to be sprung a surprise in the form of a rally. The chart, to me certainly does not discount that possibility right now. EDIT: Price is only 6 pips from the S3 PP, and it may be possible that around this zone - just 14 pips above parity - the Aussie will find it pretty tough to continue to drop. Let's see how this dog hunts! Price has consolidated over the past 5 hours, around 1.0030, so support is being realized - at least temporarily.

That MACD is interesting too - I wonder if you use it for the divergence purposes it so clearly displays atm? You are causing me to rethink my MA strategy too. For example - sometimes it is as clear as day that the MA's are going to cross, but I have not been taking my trades until they actually cross. This is ok in the higher TF like Daily or 8H, but in the 4H and perhaps 1H if I am looking to fine tune an entry (this happens when the 1H ATR is >20 pips or so, if I am inclined to bother) the crossing of the MA's can mean big pips if a sudden move catches me unawares. So I may begin to pay more attention to PA - ass seen in entries that break the low of the previous candle. As it is, all parts of my system have their place. I need to be seeing all the signals confirmed - not just 2-out-of-3. This has been refined so many times, and is as close as I expect to get to consistency in a strategy. I am taking on board the things I am seeing from your charts. I am sure I am moving ground a little, in that you are showing me that there is more than one way to skin a chat (French) ... or a chart!