Ingot54

Might be a tad off-topic, but there is a certain schadenfreude in this article Why Knight lost $440 million in 45 minutes - The Term Sheet: Fortune's deals blog Term Sheet Those with the fastest algo don't always win ... :missy:

The rule does seem harsh, OT, but the upside is ... it will encourage traders to tighten up their entries and trade management. The down side? It will encourage traders to focus more on intra-day setups and push towards over-trading perhaps. Personally I find 5% DD claustrophobic, but I am participating to gain experience under these conditions. My TF is a bit longer than intra-day. I hope the rules might be adjusted to encompass those like myself. My thoughts would be that DD should be left to the trader's discretion, or raised to 20% (arbitrary figure). My reasoning is that if a trader allows the trade to bomb (to the extent of 20%) he is either confident of his direction, to make it back up, or he will find it difficult to regain that lost capital in subsequent trades. Under competitions held over 25 trading days (+/-) it is more probable that a trader would be more astute with margins. My thoughts: Stretch or abandon the DD limitation.

So ... Predictor ... you were saying ... before the thread was hijacked by the patronising and insecure one, who feels threatened by the discussion. I want to get into a discussion - not engage some infantile tit-for-tat-I-can-piss-over-walls self-proclaimed genius who is a hero in his bathroom mirror. I dunno why he gets oxygen, to be candid. The thread's been pissed on. Can we address the OP's topic please, and not follow the agenda of some trading stud who wonders if he can still get it up, after his personality bypass surgery? And hurry please ... my nurse is on his way!

How are we going setting up our trading accounts? We have 24 days left in which to establish our Oanda accounts, and become used to executing trades with it. Anyone having problems can ask here for assistance. Also, more vacancies are waiting to be filled for the contest. If I am going to come last in this thing, I want it known that it took a lot of other traders to beat me! 1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. Youri 4. Obsidian 5. Xparm 6. MP21 7. UWCFX 8. Kuokam 9. Mystic Forex 10.Nicoacademia 11. MadMarketScientist 12. ForexTraderX 13. Nviet 14. 15. 16. 17 18. ..................

Predictor - I am fast becoming a fan of yours, partly because of your ability to ignore the pomposity of ego-centric detractors while holding true to the topic ... and partly because the lateral thinking with which you approach the topic is causing me to follow suite. Thanks for your innovation. I am certain you are developing an appreciative following.

You might be right forexlady101, but I have never been able to get "price" to work any better than any other indicator - leading or lagging - and I have about 10,000 hours of screen time between my ears. There have been whole forums dedicated to price. And whole forums dedicated to the discussion of trading ... every member looking to participate in dialogue ... or lurking ... in a quest for an improved edge. I only use one indicator - one lagging indicator ... and I am just as successful as ever It is intriguing to see some traders' charts with many indicators ... sometimes even the same indicator repeated in a different window on the chart, using different settings. I guess that must be working for them. I won't nominate any particular indicator, because they all have something to show ... but generally, one must understand the indicator, and what it does. Then one must M-A-S-T-E-R one strategy based on what that single indicator is revealing. Labeling indicators as "lagging or leading" just muddies the water for me - but I acknowledge good and successful traders (I am led to believe) use these to advantage. It might be fairly safe to say that there may be many ways to skim the markets ... all the trader has to do is to become successful at ONE of them.

I like the way you are thinking, Predictor. Clearly everyone has different views on your approaches to problem-solving, but the forum is so much the richer for that. When contributors participate in ways that are not in the spirit of the discussion, such as we see from time to time, but dare not name it for what it is, do we weaken our position? Is that succumbing to fear of confrontation? My approach to being insulted on forums is to give the antagonist no further oxygen. They like to make their point and then announce they are taking no further part - BUT ... usually they lurk in the background, looking to see what effects their comments have had. Almost 100% of times, they will be back ... this personality can not resist taking one last swipe ... or more than one "last swipe." Where does that antagonist fit, in the scheme of things? There is no rule that says they deserve a response to bad manners, baiting, trolling, ego-stroking ... and so on. But was that a poor judgement? Was the post "bad manners, baiting, trolling, ego-stroking" ... or was it a legit contribution? One thing such a member can not brook, is being ignored. It takes all types to form a forum ... and as you said plainly in the OP, there are 5 types - we have seen a few of them. I would class myself in one of the categories one day, and differently on another day. That's ok ... but at the same time, the Internet forum being what it is, it quite often happens that the typed-versus-spoken word is frequently misconstrued, and we may get pigeon-holed into a slot we might not have deserved. Thanks for the thread.

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. Youri 4. Obsidian 5. Xparm 6. MP21 7. UWCFX 8. Kuokam 9. Mystic Forex 10.Nicoacademia 11. MadMarketScientist 12. ForexTraderX 13. Nviet 14. 15. 16. 17 18. .................. Welcome to Trading Laboratory Forums Nviet ... and thank you for joining the contest. Thanks for stepping up, ForexTraderX ... I have added your name to the list of starters. You can still opt out of course. The comp runs just for the Calendar Month of September, defined by the first and last trading days of that month. We should be able to grow this comp, and have it every month. If there is enough interest, the comp could be run over any period of time the members would like. I like the sound of a quarterly contest personally, because of the TF I trade, and because healthy trades don't have to be closed out prematurely to realise profits that will count towards the final tally. Thanks for your interest. Ivan

Mystic ... could you please extrapolate that rule highlighted in red. Does the 5% refer to the combined DD of ALL positions ... or just individual trades? If I set a SL of 5% of trading capital per pair, that would be $2500 risk on each trade if using a $50k a/c size. 10 simultaneous trades means $25k at risk of DD ... 50% of a/c. On the other hand (there is always another hand) 5% DD means I could have a max $2500 at risk of DD at any one occasion. Some traders don't have a lot of DD ... others swim in it! Could you define the exact meaning - total a/c DD ($2500) ... or per pair/instrument traded ($2500 DD per position). Thanks ... and thanks for taking this contest forward.

It's just a loss, Bob ... traders know how to take 'em Thanks for lightening me up!

Siuya - good to be back mate. I think though, that you might re-read what I wrote. You are close to misrepresenting what I said - I didn't infer that the games were a bad thing - only that current priorities are back-to-front. You don't play games in front of people why are crying, and to me - apparent ONLY to me - this is not something I would do. Let's bring the poor and starving of the world and give them a front seat. Let's feed them at the same tables as the officials. Because those who are suffering are not in sight, does not make it OK to be celebrating ANYTHING to the extent of these ostentatious games. I other places of the world, austerity is being imposed on people through no fault of their own. In still other places, austerity is all they have ever known. If that is a downer - then too bad - it is also a fact. You selected parts of my post to quote, while leaving other bits out. I would like to say that I am pleased with your choice - those are EXACTLY the parts I wanted to highlight - thank you. By the way - I am unsure that ANY country has EVER made a profit from the games, despite spending billions to stage them. The official figures spin it differently, I am certain. Maybe those billions would make some difference to someone in another place? But as I mentioned - they ARE a good psychological circuit-breaker in the midst of a deteriorating world. And for a few weeks, they do stroke the ego and make a very small percentage of people ecstatically happy. I just can't join in with the "fun." I do spend quite a bit of effort to make a difference, and I have volunteered to help in some horrible places, but that is personal, and no one really gives a toss about it - and rightly so. It doesn't affect them, or add to their bottom line. And of course, the world is all about the bottom line, isn't it? Re your last line: I could ask you the same thing - when did you volunteer to help in some horrible places? But that's none of my business. China swept millions from their homes to create a showpiece for the 2008 spectacle. Was that "in the spirit of the games"? Games? Anyway - as I am on my own here, and I have rained on a very important parade, I think it prudent for me to desist from further comment. Yes ... I'm back

The world does not deserve to hold games of any sort. I can't 't avoid watching when it's on TV at work ... and yes I'd be hypocritical if I said I didn't enjoy them. But I can't conscience the spending of this money to run "games" when even one child in the world is starving. Now you can spin that any way you choose - it doesn't affect me. The facts do. While the staging of this feel-good-fest is not a bad thing - it's a great healer of nations and a wonderful psychological circuit-breaker from the tremendous pressures placed on the planet by a handful of financiers who need to brought to heel (but will never be, because the regulator is just as corrupt). But we need to get our priorities right, and be making real progress to clean up the planet in every way, before we can feel good about ouselves. I hope every nation gains from the games, and I hope those who hold an opposite view ... or a more accommodating view to mine ... really enjoy them. Under better circumstances I would too. I'm just not in the mood to celebrate "games" while brothers and sisters suffer.

Academic "success" can also depend on how well you can cheat ... eg being foxy enough to get the test answers prior to final exams ... or getting the right person to sit the exam for you ... or knowing which underground site can issue your exam "pass" certificate. I was once offered a medical degree (or any other degree I chose) from an obscure university via a URL ... there might be more than a few of those floating in the system! Further, a story did the rounds that a first year med student complained about a high result in the Physics subject being one of the prerequisites to enter the faculty of medicine. "Why is this" he complained, "when Physics is not really used in the study of human physiology and illness/wellness. Physics is a difficult subject." The professor responded: "Because we don't want idiots qualifying as doctors." I guess it is the same in trading. Judging by my trading results in the past, I should have worked a lot harder on my year 12 Physics! In my field I have worked with some professional idiots, yet they far out-rank me! One would think there would be a more appropriate entry requirement than academic achievement to qualify for a corporate trading spot. Words such as adaptability, teachability, coolness under pressure, patience, tolerance come to mind. And I agree with The Negotiator and MightyMouse ... the real qualification for trading is not usually measurable academically - ie there is no screening test that guarantees the winner will also make a good trader. Academic success can assist ... it is not essential. I think the cliche: "killer instinct" might be handy ... because such people, to my mind, would exhibit such things as focus, discipline, consistency. Of course, as we have heard elsewhere, being a sociopath almost guarantees you a job too! But to be honest, without experiencing the processfirst-hand, I simply have only an opinion, and that opinion will also be formed from concepts and preconceptions based on fact, fiction and hearsay!

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. Youri 4. Obsidian 5. Xparm 6. MP21 7. UWCFX 8. Kuokam 9. Mystic Forex 10.Nicoacademia 11. 12. 13. 14. 15. .................. Keep posting Nicoacademia - the delay in your post appearing is an unfortunate side-effect of the influence of spammers on our freedom. I think you need around ten posts from memory to overcome the delay. Thanks for your entry - it is encouraging. The comp starts with market open on Monday 3rd September, and ends with market close Friday 28th September. Mystic Forex will have more to say about this under the rules to be announced, and it is possible there will be a refinement to the closing hour at the end, to allow for position closure and calculation. It was midnight last time on the last (trading) day of the month. By the way - welcome to Traders Laboratory, and to the contest. In this laboratory you will find a mixed bunch of market scientists indeed!

I know there are a lot of people trading Forex, or just getting into it, who read the Forex threads. I found over 80 people in the Forex threads who have posted in the past year or two, and I believe there are many more who read a lot, but never post. You know who you are - you have been a member of TL for a long time - some of you going back years. Some of you have never posted here, and some of you have only 3, 8 or a dozen posts in those years. No one knows who you are, personally speaking - all of us are just names on a screen. But behind that, we are human beings who are trying to do better - struggling to make the switch from working for wages to getting some regular money from Forex trading. These kinds of competitions can only be for your benefit. Firstly the act of participating exposes you to effort - it makes you get your act together and trade in a situation where you feel you need to do some firm analysis and make trading decisions. Secondly it exposes you to other traders who are not doing too badly, and gives you an opportunity to see what can really be done in this financial field. Thirdly - it gives you an opportunity to put a new strategy to the test, under disciplined conditions. You will only have one month to find a trade, and execute it through all of the steps - position-size it, get it to break-even, and manage it through to its exit. There are other benefits such as meeting other traders and getting to share in their way of trading - most will share either publicly or privately with you, if you ask them. I know many traders want to keep their strategy close to their chest - that's good too, but at the end of the day everyone learns and we become better for the effort. I could keep going like this, but my point here is to simply encourage people who are shy, or not wanting to expose their good or bad trading to the public, to try to put that aside, and take the plunge here. No one s going to care or remember much of who did what in this contest, and certainly no one is going to be exposed to any detriment for not winning. There will be only one winner - the rest of us are hardly going to be ashamed for being a part of it. That's why I urge you, if you are interested, to just have a go. This is one of the best opportunities around to try out trading with people in a decent forum, who can only help you do better. If you have any concerns about how to participate, how to register with Oanda, or anything else to do with getting organised, but don't feel you could ask that here - send me a pm, and I promise I will work with you to get started. I know also that there are hundreds of people who do not consider their English skills to be "good enough" to try this. Let me ask you - when will your language be good enough? And now, let me tell you - if you can read this, then you are already good enough. I have had to learn a foreign language, so I understand the pressure to be understood. But I know TL is a good forum, where people are inclined to understand and help you - please don't worry that your English is not good enough - we will understand you - just try. Participation in this contest could be the best step you could make to finally get your trading moving forward. Most of us here were also beginners at one time, but there certainly were not these opportunities around 8 years ago when I began trading. And there were even fewer people who knew what they were doing, or who wanted to help others. Sorry if I sound patronising - I don't mean to be. I just want people to feel accepted and to try this, knowing they are in good company. Have a go. Kind regards Ivan

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. Youri 4. Obsidian 5. Xparm 6. MP21 7. UWCFX 8. Koukam 9. Mystic Forex 10. 11. 12. 13. 14. .................. Welcome to those brave enough to have a go - good on you. Keep those entries coming in folks. The next step is to get a demo account established at Oanda ... and spend the rest of the free time you have getting used to trading the platform (position sizing, opening and closing trades ... the usual stuff). You will only need your Oanda account number and your username to enter. Go to OANDA - Forex Trading and Exchange Rates Services | OANDA and scroll down to "Forex Trading" and select "Forex Demo Account." Forex Demo Account | OANDA fxTrade Just register, follow the instructions and you are on your way. Later I am sure we will have the contest registered, and a link will be provided for you to click to join. Mystic Forex is the man - he ran the contest seamlessly last year. When we get the numbers, I think he can be coaxed to run it again ... please? Note to Mystic: I am including your name in the list of contestants ... you know you want to do this!

You forgot to mention ... they don't have our surf! There are still a few traders on the Sunny Coast, though I have not rubbed shoulders with too many. I corresponded with Youri from Wurtulla today - didn't know he was there (Russian bloke) - he may have been around in your earlier times? Awhile ago I stopped looking for a strategy and decided to master what I am already doing. That sort of focus pays in spades ... only wish I had done it 6 years earlier! Will look you up when I am next on the coast - I still have family there and am possibly moving back before Chrissy. Keepacoldieinnafridge! Nice to touch base again. I have followed a bit of your work through different people with good blogs who linked to you (Lance Beggs is one). Also wondering about Chris Shea - is he still in the coaching business? His book deserved far more exposure and popularity than it received - an excellent beginners starting point to get the head around the market's tricks. Cheers mate ... sorry to take the thread off-topic.

Plugger - I used to live on the Sunshine Coast, and attended Davin Clarke's free trading info evenings at Kawana Community Centre. Your numbers sound very, very similar to Davin's. The numbers I heard from a "reliable source" were that Davin paid Commsec $330,000 commish between 1st July and end September ... probably around 2006 or 2007. Davin is now in the USA I believe, where he is involved in the teaching/coaching side of the markets these days. Like you, Davin made many rapid trades in a relatively short period. I am thinking that if you are not Davin Clarke, then you must know him or know of him. The effort was extraordinary for the times, as was yours. Well done.

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. Youri 4. Obsidian 5. 6. 7. 8..................

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3.Youri 4. 5. 6. 7..................

The contest that Mystic Forex ran back in March-April 2011 was based on contestants joining the competition by entering their a/c number into the contest registered by Mystic Forex. It was done this way to give Mystic access to the trades and balances, in order to publish regular figures and a leader-board, and ultimately to determine the winner. The Oanda a/c will be a demo account, linked under Mystic Forex's supervision / sub/account, I believe. Go back to the beginning of this thread and read posts #27 -to - # 30. That will explain a lot of it. Keep reading and you will see how it played out. Once you have a demo account with Oanda, you can go to the "Contests" section, and register with the "Mystic Forex" group - at least that's how is worked last year, and should be the same this time. To answer your question more fully - so far Oanda is the only place we have operated. Do you know of any other platforms we can co-ordinate the trades closely enough to manage the contest? Many traders may have tried MT4 or some of the others, but Oanda seems purpose-built for this.

1. Ingot54 2. PWP 3. 4. 5. 6.................. I believe under the old rules, we could trade any instrument that was offered by Oanda. or was it confined to Forex only? Can you confirm this, Mystic?

We'll get them! Build it ... they will come!

We have 7 days to organise a comp for August. Obviously too short a time frame to muster the entries, going on past efforts. I think the Oanda model was excellent - results were beyond questioning as Mystic Forex had access to the final numbers. The Oanda platform is not a rocket manual, and is only required for placing trades, not charting - you can do that at your current place and just use Oanda for the actual demo trades. Can we start counting heads for this ... maybe for September? With the current TL membership numbers (77,000) it should be a shoo-in to grab 10 starters! 1. Ingot54 2. 3. 4. 5 .................. Maybe we need to offer some incentive ... like CMC did ... below. EDIT: Maybe charge $10/entry ... winner-take-all? Just thoughts to kick the can along.

Bit more on the Ron-Paul-Ben-Bernanke war of ideas on thrill-hill! Audit the Fed? Bernanke fights back against Ron Paul By Annalyn Censky @CNNMoney July 18, 2012: 4:11 PM ET Audit the Fed? Bernanke fights back against Ron Paul - Jul. 18, 2012 There is an interesting video in the story - worth waiting for the 30-second advert to get out of the way. (These free-to-air sites are trying to get us to subscribe by hitting us with longer and longer advertising before we get to the cheese!) For TA traders, there's a related sroty here, regarding the next round of QE mooted: Fed officials fear risks of more easing - Jul. 11, 2012