brownsfan019

That's a good point Robert. Again, as I've tried to stress here, make sure you watch these VBC charts in real-time for days/weeks before putting any real money on the line. And Robert hit the nail on the head that each instrument is different and will react differently based on the settings that you chose. There is no perfect answer to the question - what should I set my VBC chart at. What works for me or Robert may not work for you. Test, test and test some more until you prove to yourself that either you like the VBC's or don't and then prove to yourself what setting you like the VBC at for each instrument you trade.

Interesting Walter. Some good info for those considering divergence trading.

Walter - thanks for sharing, interesting charts! Are you exclusively trading this setup or using this in addition to your other trading? Just an FYI for any newbies to divergences - as Walter has illustrated here, be sure to have some sort of filtering system before trading divergences. This is coming from experience... I attached a screenshot where I highlighted all possible divergences on the indicator looking purely at divergences. As you can see, there are many trades, most of which failed. I simply wanted to provide a little real world experience and hopefully save some trader(s) a few bucks before jumping into divergences! The books make them look so easy! :mad:

Sharp, this piggybacks on our WRB discussion here - http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f34/wide-range-bodies-big-candles-1480.html I think the WRB's are the result of a momentary imbalance between the bulls and the bears. I have not seen any correlation to a thin DOM, actually quite the opposite. WRB's usually form when there is high volume and action taking place. Keep in mind that the 'high' volume I am referring to is relative to the immediate trading taking place. In other words, we may get a 'high volume WRB push' but in the context of the overall day, this may be 'low' volume. If you are going to watch these in real time, you'll see what I am talking about. I can't stress enough how important and eye opening it is when you watch VBC charts form in real time, esp at the open and around news as Sharp mentioned. It's amazing at how quickly candles will print during those times.

Sharp - welcome to the discussion. Here's what I found very useful from your post: * I've taken a look at VBCs and I liked their visual impact. They look cleaner than regular charts. * I believe VBCs are useful because you know what you get for each candlestick printed on the chart. All you gotta do is interpret the price action and be better focused on the actual pattern signals, while trading off time charts you have to worry both about the patterns and volume. * I found it pretty decent and I must say it's really fast around the open and news times, when many contracts are exchanged. I think those 3 points summarize VBC's well for a new person looking at them. I personally only use VBC charts in my analysis as I have found them much more reliable for my style of trading. I've mentioned this here, but after reading the 3rd point I highlighted here - if you attempt to use VBC's in your trading, you must be focused and ready to pounce on trades that appear. You do NOT have time to 2nd guess yourself, esp during fast printing times. The best analogy I have tonight is you need to act like a cheetah lying in the weeds just waiting for your chance to pounce on your prey. You'll have milliseconds to pounce on that prey, but when you do... watch out! As you said, there is no grail. It does not exist. What does exist is the possibility of creating a trading methodology that works for you. Once you find this, you have found your 'grail'.

It's not an easy decision to make on how to take the board forward. James, I think you need to understand that you are not going to make everyone happy and that's just the way it is. Great ideas and thoughts in this thread, I guess we'll see where the ship ends up being steered. I like the idea of a resident 'expert' / moderator / etc on particular topics. The only problem there is if someone is going to spend time with the newbies and such, there has to be something in it for them to keep them over the long haul. I think most of us would jump up and help right now, but 3, 6, 12 months down the road, being the resident newbie question answerer guy could lose it's flare... Just something to think about. I also like the glossary idea James. I think this could save a lot of repeat questions and wasted time on the boards.

If displayed in candle format, that 'nose' is a gravestone doji and all three candles together would have been an evening star. That's probably why a lot of these 'formations' work - whether using a candle chart or line chart, the essence of what is being shown is the same.

I use this one - Big Free Clock - Current time any size digits on screen

I just found this and it has some nice features - Main Page - IE7Pro WiKi It's an add-on for those running IE7.

sds - I trade multiple contracts, but simply to get the returns that I am looking for. With that being said, I used to do something like Tin illustrated for us here, but after a real hard look at arbitrary fixed profit levels, I am focusing my efforts on exiting based on 'what the market is telling you' vs. holding and hoping... I started a thread here in case you did not see it - http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/f34/wide-range-bodies-big-candles-1480.html I have found that having set profit levels out there is great when they are hit, but you really can 2nd guess yourself when they are almost hit. For example, I remember a trade that was last week or the week before on the YM. My profit target was at +20 based on the strategy being used at that time. It was a short and looked great! The move went exactly 19 points and not one more. My order was just sitting there - an MIT order actually. It just had to move one more point and I was out with a nice trade. Well, that one more point never happened... Talk about kicking yourself in the ass over that...

Bramble - first, make sure you've read the entire thread that I started here, not just looking at the charts. A lot is explained before the posted charts. The exit strategy on Visual WRB's on a VBC Chart is simple - after the trade moves +X points in my favor, when a WRB appears, I flatten my position on the close of the WRB. So, when looking at the charts I've posted, anything highlighed in white is a possible exit point. My exact entry points are not annotated on purpose as that is not the purpose of this thread nor am I here to disclose every little way that I trade. My trading system is pretty much scattered on this forum is anyone wants to look close enough for it. Fair warning though - it's much simpler than most people 'want' trading to be. As for why my entry is relevant is b/c I am not willing to risk 5 ticks to make 3. I'm just not going to do that. I must make at least what I am risking. I've also noted in my brief Visual WRB analysis on VBC Charts that it's not uncommon to see at least 2 WRB's in what I consider a 'move'. Therefore, if the first WRB appears shortly after I enter, I'm not interested in that one. Since I've seen that on VBC Charts that I can expect multiple WRB's usually in a trade setup, I am simply waiting for the 2nd to appear after my minimum profit level has been reached. With that being said, my minimim profit level is not huge or outrageous. I'm simply looking to cover at least the amount of risk in the trade. As for the trade mgmt part - again, it's rather simple - either I will get a Visual WRB after my minimum profit level is reached or I will probably be stopped out for a loss. Since my losses are 3-6 ticks, I'm not concerned with those. What I am concerned with is getting out after a nice volume push and then looking to re-enter a trade.

Mark - using WRB's is much less stressful and here's why - When I see one (once my minimum profit level is reached), I'm out. No 2nd guessing, wondering what to do or worse - watch a trade come w/in ticks of a profit level and then reverse. I attached an example on the EC that just took place. Note: That EC Trade with WRB just happened to call the high of the day so far as of 8:22am EST. If I had a fixed target, it would not have been reached and I would have been stopped out for a loss...

http://www.techsmith.com/snagit.asp It is the best $39.95 you will ever spend. I use SnagIt for so many things, esp to annotate charts quickly. I used Microsoft paint, but what a pain that thing is. SnagIt is one of the most useful programs I use for anything and everything! And if you want to make videos and such, Camtasia is a great program as well! http://www.techsmith.com/camtasia.asp

Mark - I don't want to hijack this thread, so I posted screenshots at the thread I started - http://www.traderslaboratory.com/forums/34/wide-range-bodies-big-candles-1480-3.html Let me know what you think!

Chart #4: EC 450 VBC Chart with Visual WRB's highlighted Here's an EC chart with Visual WRB's in white. To me, the WRB's were excellent for exit point(s) if long into that move. As you can see, price popped and then retraced back to the starting point.

Chart #3: YM 450 VBC Chart with Visual WRB's highlighted I like this example - we have a nice down move on the left and if short, 3 possible exits with WRB's. The first one would probably not pass my 'is this into profit enough' test, but the 2nd and/or 3rd would for sure. Now the key for me is this - let's say you were sitting on a fixed profit target that was not quite reached. What do you do? Sit and wait thru all that chop and see what happens or bail on the trade? That's what I always struggled with. As you can see, using the visual WRB's, the 2nd and/or 3rd WRB are great exits in my opinion b/c: 1) You get out during the momentum and the move, so you are not waiting around (and can then look for other trades, call it a day, etc.). 2) If using a trail stop, I would have inevitably been taken out during the chop, if using a set target it would not have been hit & then retraced and/or get to watch the chop for hours to see what happens...

Chart #2: YM 450 VBC Chart with Visual WRB's highlighted This chart is a little more 'interesting'... If short into the first down move on the left, I see one possible WRB for exit purposes. It's not the low of the move, but still a good exit (for me). Then we get a push move up in the middle of the chart, and two possible visual WRB's. For me, to go against the downtrend may be more aggressive, but still a nice little long trade with WRB's. Lastly, if short (from initial short or a new one) we have a couple WRB's appear.

Per NihabaAshi's request, I will include a few screenshots for review of WRB's. Chart #1: YM 450 VBC Chart with Visual WRB's highlighted In this chart, if you are short heading into the down move and subsequent WRB's (highlighted in white), I think exiting at the 2nd and/or 3rd WRB is a great exit. I would have even considered the first one, but as I mentioned in another thread, I am not interested in WRB's that occur shortly after entry. Taking a YM trade for +3 or +4 is not going to cut it for me. So, once the position reaches at least +5 (on the YM) then I will consider a WRB for exit purposes.

FXMarketSpace Home Just in case anyone else was following this... FAQ Q: Will FXMarketSpace be available to retail investors? A: FXMarketSpace will be an institutional trading platform, not open to "retail" participants. In general, market participants would have to meet the FSA definition of a "Market Counterparty". Individuals would have to be sophisticated investors, typically with a net worth over $20 million.

Pivot - I don't call myself a scalper, but some might think so. :p I see what you are saying about the WRB and the largest body of the last 3 intervals. I am equating WRB with big candle and that is not how you are using them. My only concern with using the last 3, 5 or whatever intervals was that when I looked at doing that and coded into TS, it was giving me 'WRBs' that I did not think were good exits at all... Again, I may be using a very simplified and literal interpretation of WRB, but I was just not impressed saying of the last X intervals, if this body is bigger, I am out. Have you really tested and looked at that analysis? I guess it also depends on the type of chart and timeframe being used. I am using 450 share bars on the YM, so with that 'low' of a setting, it's easy for many WRB's to print based on the interval analysis, which ends up taking me out of trades almost immediately after entry... So, that's not going to work for me. After some more analysis on my end using WRB's in the literal sense, I am comfortable with them as exits, but only after the trade moves so much in my favor. In other words, once the trade moves +8 on the YM, then I will look for a WRB as reason to exit. The idea being that I cannot be taken out at +3, even if a 'WRB' technically showed up. I realize that this may conflict with the idea of taking what the market gives you, but I also cannot turn a trade that would have delivered nicely into +3.

OK let me see if I have it - first, you exit some of your contracts on the first WRB. Your trail stop is placed 1-2 ticks below the body on the remaining portion and either another WRB will form later or that trail stop on the remainder will be taken out... correct? And how long are you willing to wait for that next WRB? You could easily have a stop that would not be in jeopardy of being hit, but also not get a WRB shortly after the first. In other words, if price just slowly chugs up and down far enough from your stop, but not enough to create another WRB, what's a trader to do? Just sit and wait? At that point, I think that's more hope than anything... Just my view though. It's kinda funny how our views and ideas can change over time... With WRB's as exits, I am getting in, getting out and waiting for the next set up. If you have multiple WRB's or set profit levels, you can stay in a trade for many minutes or even hour(s). I used to do that - sit and wait b/c my profit level was +20 and I wasn't budging till then. For me, this is a much better way for me to trade as I am not always the most patient. So, instead of getting into a trade and feeling like it is taking forever for my profit to hit, I am simply looking for a boost of volume in my direction and then exiting the trade. And while it does create more trades during the day, it keeps my attention more and with more round turns, I can keep negotiating that rate down. :p

I saw it Sat night & thought it was great! I'd like to learn the 'real' story, so I will check the history channel out. Here's the link to the history channel thing if interested: Last Stand of The 300

Not sure I agree with that Pivot... Again, it's all based on each trader's trading methodology, but for me and using snug stops, more often than not, the market may tip my stop and then move if I get 'greedy'. This was why I was using set profit targets that we discussed in another thread. I needed a way to exit before any threat of a retracement. So far, WRB's seem to help with this. Great statement. I only wish I had looked at WRB's more closely sooner! That is another idea Pivot. Thanks for sharing... I will have to consider a stop movement based on the WRB. Question though - where exactly would you move it to? Take a look at my attached chart and let me know what you think. If I trailed that stop in that example, I would inevitably be taken out at the low of that red candle...

Not sure what he was looking for since he said equi / volume based, which are two different things. I thought TS had equivolume as well though.

Bramble - I think it comes down to people working well when there is a finite goal in front of them, especially when new to trading. I personally think that for a newbie to go for $100/day at the beginning is a great idea. It gives them something to shoot for and provides the ability for a 'reward' for doing the job that day. And it's realistic to start. This thread has reminded me of my time as a broker. When we were training new brokers, we had very definite goals given to each new broker that they had to meet each day. The 'recipe' as we called it was proven time and time again - follow these steps and the likelihood of becoming a successful broker was very high. Same can be said of trading - start small and then build your daily goal over time. Then, you'll just forget about even needing a goal b/c now the habit has been developed over time. You have to train your mind to repeat the same process over and over again. Your confidence is strong from reaching your goal most days, your account size is growing and all of a sudden you feel pretty good about what you are doing. Then it's not a matter of making $100 a day, it's a matter of how many zero's are going to be at the end of your goal...