bigbird

Hi Rob, Do you have a link to his webinar? Do you need to pay for it? Thanks.

Dear Rob, Thanks. Actually, I did not mention clearly enough that my question is really about how to label X, A, B to determine a "continuation-spring". Okay, referring back to the post here, for 1.jpg, I would label 456 as XAB to determine whether a continuation-spring has happened, rather than labeling 345 as XAB. Similarly, for 2.jpg, 456 as XAB would be used for continuation-spring determination. On the other hand, for upthrust determination, we should label 345 in 1.jpg and 2.jpg as XAB. Is that correct:question: Thanks.

Dear Rob, Do you mean 10% of 3-4 and not 20%:question: Anyway, this is something new to me. I thought we should apply 10% 3-4 on the bottom boundary as well. In what situations would you label 456 as XAB:question: I attached one of Ray's charts. The blue line is the 5D while the red 18D. He labeled 456 as XAB in this situation, but I'm unable to figure out why this is so. Thanks!

Dear Rob, As you know, one of the uses of X, AB labeling that Ray taught is to allow us to compute the Maximum Extension (ME), which in turn allows us to decide whether a spring pattern has formed. Unfortunately, I met some problems labeling, I will use the figures attached to describe the problem. Though I have gone back to revise the X, AB labeling, I'm not able to ascertain the answer to my question. Referring to figure 1.jpg, I would have labeled X, A, B at 3, 4, 5. But Ray would sometimes label X, A, B at 4, 5, 6. This would give a different ME, which may give a different conclusion related to whether a continuation spring formed at 7. I'm not sure which one to use, 345, or 456:question: For 2.jpg and 3.jpg, how would you have labeled X, A, B:question:

Dear Rob, I'm referring to the chart attached in this post. Is B-C a corrective? Thanks!

Dear Rob, Is there any reason why the type of B-C in the second chart is not mentioned:question: I have edited the 3rd attachment to include more labels. Are BB-C, C-D and D-E corrective:question: This question is related to Ray's description about R0 subnormal on page 19 of the NOT book. Ray said: For example, in a 5-day up-move, the 18-day impulse move will be below mean and the 5-day impulse move will be less than average. (A 5-day impulse move usually comprises more than one 5-day impulse move.) In Figure 1.17, we have a 5-day impulse move commencing October 10,2002 and ending on December 2,2002. After the 5-day line turned down, we find that the impulse move is below average. Were there any moves that indicated this may be so before the 5-day turned down? The first 5-day move -- from October 10, 2002 to October 28, 2002 -- is mean. However, the two succeeding 5-day moves are below average, giving us a clue that the 5-day impulse move will also be below average. There is repeated mentions of 5-day which confuses me. Are the underlined words meant to be 18-day instead:question: Thanks for your time.

Hi Rob, While I was reading Ray's blog @ What is a RePo and 313Outside? Blog for Trading Success: Ray Barros, I got confused over the reply Ray gave to Wee Meng. Wee Meng asked the question: "What context is used to view a congestion pattern at C, rather than an “active” upthrust pattern?" Ray replied: "So in an uptrend, the continuation patterns occur at the bottom and the CIT pattern occurs at the top." Do you have any insight? Thanks.

Dear Rob, Regarding the mini-dow (or similarly the mini-S&P 500) being not so liquid outside of US trading hours, that's true. A quick confirmation, from your reply, for mini-dow, so I should configure my charting software to filter away data outside of regular trading hours since the 80m, 15m, etc, tf is derived from the regular trading hours:question: Currently, my daily chart is showing daily bars which are formed using the O, H, L, C of the entire 24 hours period (instead of the O, H, L, C of just the regular trading period). And currently, my 80min chart also displays bars throughout the 24 hours. If I just display bars only for the regular trading hours, the swings will look obviously different. Thanks! As you can see, I'm still at the setting up phase and have not come to the interesting stuff yet!

Hi Rob, If I use the following sequence of tf for mini-dow, SHTF: daily with 5p FHTF: 80m: 5p TTF: 15m: 5p for lagging patterns FLTF: 3m: 5p for forecasting patterns SLTF: 3m bars (or we can use 5p of 30s, but not necessary) Is it alright to use charts based on 24 hour data? Or I should restrict just to the data in regular US trading hours:question: I'm also trying to trade the EURUSD futures (6E), I suppose I can use the same tf as above, since the pit-session is also similar to mini-dow:question: Thanks!

Hi Rob, Based on what you said above, therefore, for my example, SHTF: daily with 5p FHTF: 80m: 5p TTF: 15m: 5p for lagging patterns FLTF: 3m: 5p for forecasting patterns SLTF: 3m bars (or we can use 5p of 30s, but not necessary) Right? Thanks.

Hi Rob, Thanks for relaying! For 5p swings, I would use WPC = 3 like what you have advised, what about LCC, do we stick to LCC = 3:question: In your experience with Barros Swings, is it true that most of the time, when there is acceptance beyond the ME, a WPC or a LCC would have happened:question: Thanks.

Hi Rob, I think I'm getting it, I hope. We use only the 5p or 18p, and a 5p on a TF chart is equivalent to a 1p on the next higher TF chart, a 18p on a TF chart is equivalent to a 5p on the next higher TF chart. The 18p swings should be used as the trading time frame (since it will then be possible to determine WPC, LCC). To really confirm whether I have understood, suppose my trading TF is the 18p on the 15min, and following Ray's convention on page 60: 2nd higher TF: 18p on Daily 1st higher TF: 18p on 80min Trading TF : 18p on 15min (lagging change in trend patterns) 1st lower TF: 5p on 15min (forecasting patterns) 2nd lower TF: It is not necessary to draw this swing, but for completion sake, the swing would be 18p on 30s or 5p on 3min. It looks like using 18p on 30s is a better option, but I do not know why:question: Are the above okay:question: Rob, I hope I'm not too much of a trouble to you.

Hi Rob, I'm sorry, but I do not understand still. According to page 60 of the Nature of Trends book: 2nd higher TF = 12-month swing (which I assume to be a 12-period Barros swing on monthly chart) 1st higher TF = 13-week swing (13-period Barros swing on weekly chart) trader's TF = 18-day swing (18-period Barros swing on daily chart) 1st lower TF = 5-day swing (5-period Barros swing on daily chart) 2nd lower TF = 1-day swing (1-period Barros swing on daily chart) Therefore, I have thought that a TF is uniquely defined by a n-period Barros swing on a m-period chart, and each TF must be in a somewhat logical relationship from one another. 1st lower TF is 5 times of 2nd lower TF (as there are 5 days in a week) traders TF is 4 times of 1st lower TF (4 weeks in a month, about 18days) 1st higher TF is 3 times traders TF (as there are 3 weeks in a quarter) 2nd higher TF is 4 times end TF (as there are 4 quarters in 1 year) :question:Therefore, given the 80min, 15min, 3min and 30seconds charts, what period Barros Swings should be plotted on them so that the whole series from 2nd higher TF to 2nd lower TF can be seen:question: Thanks!

Hi Rob, Thanks. Based on your reply, is the below setup correct? 18D on Daily === 2nd higher 5D on Daily === 1st higher 18D on 15 min === trader's time frame 5D on 15 min === 1st lower 5D on 3 min === 2nd lower Thanks.

Hi Rob, Thanks for clarifying, and also relaying some of these questions to Ray! :hmmmm: Should the charts be in geometric relationships, i.e., 80min chart, 80/5=15min, 15/5=3min chart (instead of 5 or 1 min)? I thought also that the Barros Swings should be in a constant geometric relationship to one another. In other words, if we use 5 as the "geometric constant", the Barros Swings I should be using would be: 1st higher tf: 5-P on 80 min (equivalent to 25-P on 15min). Trading time-frame: 5-P on 15min. This is equivalent to 1-P on 80min,and 25-P on 3min, which means that I can choose to use, besides 5-P on 15min, the 1-P on 80min and 25-p on 3min. Using 1-P on 80min is not recommended, however, as some swings will be missing. 1st lower tf: 5-P on 3min (equivalent to 1-P on 15min). Is this reasonable (i hope my description is not too messy to understand)? I'm not too sure how to apply the 5-p, 18-p swings on the 3 time-frames (80, 15, 3min) so that all 5 time frames from 2nd higher to 2nd lower are in a good geometric relations. Any suggestions?

Hi Rob, It's me again! I have a few questions related largely to WPC, LCC: QN 1 As you have said, for an upthrust to be complete, there should be a conviction bar. In standard Barros Swing time frames, I understand that this can be applied on 12-period Barros Swing on the monthly data, 13-p BS on the weekly data, and 18-p BS on the daily data. I’m trying to apply this on a different period swings on intra-day data. A 5-period Barros Swing on a 5 min chart is equivalent to a 25-P on a 1 min chart. Should I apply the above concept better on the 5-P swing or the 25-P swing? QN 2 It’s mentioned in the NOT book that for normal change in trend patterns, we don’t assume a change in trend until we have acceptance of prices beyond B and we have (in order of importance): The formation of a WPC; and The formation of a “+3 LCC”; and/or The market accepting prices beyond the maximum extension. Since a 5-P BS on 5 min is equivalent to a 25-P BS on 1 min, which should I better apply WPC, LCC to? QN 3 The context of this question is from Qn2. Is it true that once market accepts beyond the ME, it does not matter whether there is a WPC or LCC, a change in trend is assumed? Thanks!

Hi Gassah, Is there any requirement on how much the line should turn up after reaching 78.6%? Thanks.

Hi everyone, I hope this forum is still alive! I'm still reading the Nature of Trends book and has some questions regarding when a spring/upthrust pattern has failed and therefore to favour a congestion. Hope to keep this forum alive for discussions. I have 4 basic questions: a) In chapter 3 of the book, acceptance is defined by “The close”, “WPC” and “LCC”. An upthrust is complete when the price “accepts” below the psz. In this situation, do we use “The close” only, or we also consider “WPC” and “LCC” as well? b) These 2 questions refer to the chart.jpg file. The sample chart is copied from figure 1.9 (page 12) of the book. Ray's intend is to illustrate how an upthrust has failed and now favour a congestion. 1) How much must E retrace in order to conclude that the upthrust has failed and we now favored a congestion? 2) Do we shift the upper congestion boundary up to C only at the moment congestion is favored? c) This question is related to chart1.jpg. In reality, things may not be as simple as chart.jpg. Referring to chart1.jpg, for example, when the line turns to form wave DE, does it mean we now favour congestion? Or when the Wave D1-E1 is formed? It seems that D1-E1 is a better candidate to use to decide congestion. But, DE can be a good point of decision when E retraces much more into the psz. Therefore, how do we decide for this more complicated case, at each retracement, that the upthrust has failed and a congestion is favoured? Thanks a great deal!

Hi, I have read NOT and found it to be quite relevant to my trading. However, I'm unable to apply the techniques because I'm using the NinjaTrader platform that does not have Barros Swing. I tried programming the indicator based on the information given in the book but have met with some roadblocks. Does anyone have the source text from Tradestation or any platforms that can be shared for me to implement in NinjaTrader? I do not have Tradestation to read eld or els files directly. Thank you.