matinthehat

based on today's action so far, i'm expecting the 06s. Might be a good place to short based on the day's range at that point, but if internals are strong and aren't backing off up there, I wont be looking short.

What are you looking at/for on the DOM? Just the flow or the orders at the BID/ASK? Start a thread on this, i'm sure some people would appreciate it.

I started to look at MP and volume at price to find better s/r, but it actually led me to look at price in terms of brackets, and now i just outline the ranges and these work out to be pretty accurate s/r levels. Drawing ranges sure helps you to see the important levels and ignore the noise, and as a beginner i would recommend it to anyone. By the way, this works in all timeframes. P.s. I have a journal over at http://www.priceaction.net if anyone wants to see more of what i mean by price brackets.

Trying to keep things as simple as possible. ES levels for tomorrow.

I am enrolled in this school to learn accounting and they have psychology and calculus courses in the program. How the **** am i supposed to learn about accounting when i have a shit load of psychology and calculus work to do every night and little time left for accounting and business work? Even if i were to put accounting and business first, i would not have any time for psychology and calculus and thus i would fail them leading to me being kicked out of the program..... It doesn't make sense. We are rushing through every single chapter and all of the content and it is impossible to learn at that speed. Already i have 2 exams coming up and i just started last week! Like what the **** are these mindless ******* academics doing to education? Some dumbass in the corporate office probably thought this up.

I am enrolled in this school to learn accounting and they have psychology and calculus courses in the program. How the **** am i supposed to learn about accounting when i have a shit load of psychology and calculus work to do every night and little time left for accounting and business work? It doesn't make sense. We are rushing through every single chapter and all of the content and it is impossible to learn at that speed. Already i have 2 exams coming up and i just started last week! Like what the **** are these mindless ******* academics doing to education? All theories and nothing else. Also, i literally am working 13 hours a day on course material and still it is hard to keep up. I have no time to even think about the markets, go outside and have fun, or do anything else that brings joy into my life. I need this education for job security, but this ******* school is making it impossible.

i have just started university and am having problems with the course load. there is way too much information that i need to learn in the course of a week and i am having trouble finding the time. right on the first day our lectures started and we covered an entire chapter in each course. how am i supposed to learn like this? if i can't manage to cath up, should i drop out? why is university structured this way? it is not like anyone in my classes are actually learning the material, they are memorizing it.

If you do not understand your chart, then do not do anything based on it. Noone can understand every single little movement in the markets, so there is no point in trying to. When you find something that truly makes sense to you, then you should have the confidence to act on it. If you lack this confidence then you should not trade until you have it. This might be a little off-track, but i believe Brownsfan's meaning of this thread was to spark an insightful discussion, and no intelligence is being gained by everyone stating the same thing over and over again (not to step on any toes).

In Thales's example i see a weakening down-trend. The first sideways movement (indicated by '1') is either shorts covering and new longs entering (high volume) or a lack of buying and selling interest (low volume). Price then declines out of this first box indicating that there is a lack of support (low volume) or a strong new selling interest (rising volume). Most likely there is a lack of support as more shorts wait to see what will happen before they cover. Also, most likely the downward movement out of the first box was on weak volume as the old shorts would have covered if they saw that there was weak selling interest to the downside, which is most likely what they did as price rose quickly off of those new lows. As price goes into the second sideways movement (indicated by '2') either shorts are covering ((high volume) which is most likely the case as the end of the trading session is nearing + price does not look very promising to the donwside) or there once again is a lack of buying and selling interest ((low volume) which is most unlikely). As price hits the red line we see a decline in price and then another test of this line and a failure to breach. Now this is most likely because of a fight between the short coverings + new bulls and the new shorts (high volume). As the new bulls see how long the bears have been in power and the small amount of time left before the day's close, they would most likely sell out of their positions and allow the bears to take price down as much as they can before they to are forced to cover. Feel free to add and correct. I do not like to analyse charts in this fashion as i am not a strong communicator.

I agree with you that volume does not lead price, but volume does create price. Volume is the effort and price is the result.

Here is a hypothetical example: Price is making continuous higher highs and higher lows. The up-trend started quick producing a steep trend line, but over time the trend line got less and less steep until price just stopped and went sideways. The bears are not taking price down or they are unable to. The bulls are resting or they are done. Or the bulls and bears are fighting for power. Now check volume. If volume is low at the top then bulls are either resting (unlikely based on previous price action) or they are worn out. But the bears are equally not present and this is beacuse they are waiting for higher prices, or because they are unsure, or because there just are not enough bear traders (new shorts and previous bulls selling their longs and turning into bears). If volume is high, then the bulls and the bears are fighting for dominance. The bears will most likely win based on the length of the up-trend, but the bulls could still win out if they attract a strong following of new bulls. If the bears win out then when price action starts to drift downwards the bulls who entered in at the top would be compelled to sell and possibly become new bears, adding to the supply. Either way, if the up-trend was a lengthy one, then there is a good chance that the bulls will be unable to proceed as the majority of the bulls who wanted to express their opions have already done so. Volume and price are reflecting what has happened already. No matter what you see on your charts, it is all past action. To me anyways, trying to guess,based on previous action, where price is most likely to go is just plain fun. I would rather develop my own opinion on the market than have some formula based indicator tell me what is happening. I would rather potentially profit (or lose) from my own analysis than have some indicator "guarantee" me profit (or loss). But, I am here because I am having fun. If I was not having fun, I would not be here.

Volume produces price. Volume is a graphic of trader effort. Price is the result of trader effort. No trader, no volume. No volume, no price. No price, nothing. I think that volume is important to the extent that it enables you to make a good guess as to what the motives of the traders are. IMO you can still trade profitably using price and price only, but if you want to give your analysis that extra depth, then volume would be a useful tool.

Hey man, here is something i was using. It is almost exactly what you are looking for. http://www.splinterware.com/products/idailydiary.htm

I am a beginner and am reading Trading and Exchanges: Market Microstructure for Practitioners by Larry Harris. This book is amazing. It will not teach you about market profile, but it will teach you everything you need to know about the markets and trading.

What a messed up world we live in.

Studies in tape reading/Day trader's bible Techniques of tape reading Tape reading and market tactics

Hi, here is another attempt at "all of this." please correct me and give me your opinions on what i am doing wrong. (if i have missed labeling something then please tell me). Thanks. 1. Price makes little upward progress on higher volume (This is the top of the previous move). Demand and supply are about equal but demand is a little greater than supply. This suggests a halt and I think one would need to wait until something happened before they could make a call as to what direction price is likely to go in. 2.At first price declines on rising volume. This suggests that price is running into support, but supply is still greater than demand. Price then forms a small bodied bar (“A”) on lower volume. This suggests that at this price demand and supply are about the same. Price then forms a downward bar that pulls back a little after reaching the low of the bar two bars before it. This is suggests that support came in at this area. Price then continues in the downward direction on rising volume until again it forms a small bodied bar (“B“). These coupled with the higher volume decline suggest that there is still a substantial amount of demand in the market. It then resumes in the downward direction on higher volume. 3. A big bodied price bar (“C”) is formed on really heavy volume. Price went to lower prices and apparently found support and demand drove price upwards with some effort to close at the high. It also closed at a established line of support. I wouldn’t call this any type of exhaustion as the majority of the volume could have come from the support absorbing all the supply before more the price started to rise or at the old support line (now a potential resistance line) where resistance possible was offered. Price then falls on declining volume indicating that the previous bar was most likely(?) temporary exhaustion of buying pressure. This is so because now the price is declining because of a lack of demand and not because of enthusiastic sellers as the volume is not very heavy. 4. Price then forms a “T” bar (“D”) on high volume. This bar closed at its high a tiny bit below the open. This suggests that support came in (at the low of the previous big bar) and a excess of demand drove the price up. It is not on extremely heavy volume and price still closes a bit below the open, so I wouldn’t have called this the bottom yet. Price then declines on about the same amount of volume as the previous bar, suggesting a smaller amount of demand or a greater amount of supply than previously. 5. Price then declines on pretty heavy volume. This suggests prices declined with quite a lot of effort, but supply was greater than the demand. The next bar is also on pretty heavy volume. It goes to lower prices and runs into a lot of support which absorbs the majority of the supply allowing demand to raise price to close at the high. I would say that this suggests a temporary exhaustion of selling pressure. 6. Price then rises on lighter volume, suggesting that prices are rising due to a lack of selling pressure than a surge of enthusiastic buyers, but the buyers are still having to put some effort into the rise. This could reinforce the statement that a temporary selling exhaustion just took place.

Am i supposed to be looking from bar to bar or something? Seriously, i get contradiction after contradiction after contradiction.

Here is another annotated chart of the pre-market YM from about 7:00a.m. to 9:30a.m. 1. Price makes a higher low right after a higher high. This suggests strength and the trend is upwards. 2. Price stops around the previous swing high and then pulls back. It then approaches the swing high again and stays there for two bars. This suggests that there is not enough demand to push price above this level. This is an indication of weakness. 3. Price then falls and finds support at a previous level of support. It stays at this level for a while making little headway. This suggests weakness for the upside. 4. Price then breaks below support and makes a new low. It then rises upwards without enough demand to reach the previous swing high. This suggests weakness. 5. Price then falls and finds support at the most recent swing low. It stays around here for some time (confirming its importance) and then rises up. It rises up to the most recent swing high and finds resistance and is unable to break above this level. Price then plummets to form new lows. 6. Price forms a new low and stays around this level for some time. It then goes upwards and lacks enough demand to reach the previous swing high. This suggests weakness. Price then falls back down to the previous support line made by the new lows and stays here for some time. It then plummets below support. 7. Price then reaches new lows and finds support here. It stays here a while making almost no headway (unlike the previous resting spots) and then plummets below support. 8. Price makes new lows and then goes slightly upwards. It stays in this area making a very slow advance and then halts nowhere near the previous support. This suggests that there was a lack of demand indicating weakness. Price then declines and forms new lows.

Here is another attempt: I have tried to incorporate S/R lines into my analysis this time. Please feel free to point out my misjudgments and what i have overlooked. Thanks. 1. Price rises and volume decreases. The rise is due to a lack of selling pressure rather than enthusiastic buyers. The top is formed on light volume. This suggests a lack of demand. 2. Price then declines on rising volume. This suggests that there is selling interest. 3. On the way down buying support comes in around the previous swing low and drives price up. But there is a lack of demand and prices once again fall back. 4. Price declines and volume rises. This suggests that there is not strong selling pressure. 5. Price makes a new low on heavy volume. This area is tested by a second bar which has heavier volume. Price also closes near the highs. This suggest that support came in at the new low. 6. Prices then rise on declining volume. This suggests that the previous low was a exhaustion of selling. 7. Price makes a new high just below the previous swing high area on drastically low volume. This suggests that there is a lack of demand to drive prices up. 8. Price declines and stops just above a established level of support on mid-level volume. This suggests that there are buyers supporting the lower levels. Price also fails to reach its previous low, this suggests strength. 9. Price then rises on rising volume. This suggests heavier buying pressure than selling pressure. Price rises to a potential resistance line and finds resistance. This is suggested by the higher volume bar. 10. Price then declines on declining volume. This suggests a lack of buying pressure. It forms a new higher low, and this suggest strength. 11. Price again rises to a established line of resistance on higher volume and then stays there for two more bars on light volume. 12. Volume spikes and price declines. This suggest that price met resistance and selling pressure became stronger than buying pressure. Price then declines on decreasing volume. This suggests that there is a lack of buying pressure. 13. Price bottoms out on drastically light volume and fails to reach the previous swing low. This suggests a lack of supply and indicates strength. 14. Price then rises on increasing volume. This suggests that there is now buying interest and it is stronger than the selling pressure. 15. Price approaches its top on drastically light volume. This suggests a lack of buying interest. Price then approaches a previously formed resistance line and the buyers appear not to be able to break through the resistance that the sellers are establishing. 16. Price then declines on rising volume. This suggests that there is selling interest which is stronger than the buying pressure. 17. Price then is stuck around a previously formed line of support on high volume. This suggests that the buyers are supporting this line. Since it is stopped around this previously formed support line, it indicates that this support is strong and price will possibly head up (the path of least resistance).

I found this post on "JUDGING THE MARKET BY ITS OWN ACTION (Sect. 3M)" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month January, 2009"

I found this post on "BUYING AND SELLING WAVES (Sect. 5M)" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month January, 2009"

I found this post on "Time Saver: The Wyckoff Forum's Most-Thanked Posts (as of 01/15/09)" interesting and have nominated it accordingly for "Topic Of The Month January, 2009"

I have strayed away from reading any system books or anything that will give me advice on how to open/close any trades. I need to figure this out for myself. Right now i have a few books on the go: Trading and Exchanges, New Market Wizards, and Tape reading and Market Tactics. Research has taught me that the only information to rely on is price information.

DB's Price, Volume, etc. Q&A in my opinion is a brilliant compilation. I just read it today and i admit that i learned more from that than i did from anything else i have read so far. Thanks DB. 10/10 This stuck out: The spider does not need to "feed" everyday. He is content to wait until a morsel comes his way, patient and secure in the knowledge that he has taken the steps necessary for his survival. His carefully crafted web transmits to him all sorts of information. But he knows how to identify the false signals~ the wind vibrating his web, a drop of rain~ from the real thing enmeshed in it. Why does he know it so intimately? Because he has carefully constructed his web himself. No one else can build it for him. As a result, the configuration of his web is as uniquely his as his fingerprints. Most important, the spider is patient. He waits until he sees a convergence of most all of his signals before he acts; but when he does, he pounces aggressively and without hesitation.