tech/a

Of course of course!!!!!:crap: That WAS a dyslexia moment.:doh: Thanks back to my bingo game!

Possibly having a blond Seniors moment! But seeing a test in the cash I cant see how this can be seen as a positive move for the futures (unless of course for the short side). Why on earth would you go long on a confirmed test showing lack of supply?

Ed The bar in question is 50 million The average form the latest high to this bar is 900,000.

Mister ed. Yes your right on the money with regard to R/R. Leave a trade to long and R/R becomes a definate issue with regard to timeframes. All will become clearer with this example as we go along. I'm actually attempting to answer or more so clarify a few statements made here by others. As for Elliott yes for me this is the case,better timing means smaller risk,and better R/R over shorter periods which mean more trades which mean better profit.(In my timeframe/s). But this exercise is based purely around VSA. So to the next chart. Is this following bar then showing lack of supply or lack of demand and why? Is this a test or is the range and volume on the previous bar a sure sign of a new era of fresh buying. Selling exhausted. Following this comment on a test

Thanks for that clarification. Pity there aren't more people joining in the discussion with opinion. You wouldn't be a Market Profile trader would you? From your avatar.

TG Initially you said. Now you need to see a test of this bar, I'm intersted in why? So if price just continued up then you'd not be on the trade? Price has now moved a great deal from the initial "Setup" or Test bar. Isnt the risk if trading long on this setup becoming too great? I maybe wrong but Id have thought your buy (given the above in quotes) would have been the break with a stop below the second bar. TG What "sort" of trader are you? How do you incorporate VSA into your trading?

OK. The very next bar----WOW! This bar then would confirm the statement made here? So this would be seen as BUYING VOLUME and the test then is confirmed? Just to get my head around your thinking/interpretation. We have a confirmed test and can expect higher prices?

PP Excellent points re Effort/Result and will become important going forward. How does everyone view the Extreme Volume bar back before this 3 bar cluster. Do you think it has significance and if so how so? So to re cap we would buy on a good breakout above the past 3 bars,with volume---any exceptions to that? Even though the buyers couldnt close the bar over 50% of its range?

Tin Sorry a bit off topic. How do I post charts clearly here? I use photo bucket but when width is important to "See it all" Detail is lost due to re sizing. Would I be correct in thinking a direct link would serve best? On the chart---fair comments---I have more but will let the question run a little longer to hopefully gain more comment.There is a point to it all.

From the discussion so far I'm interested in how those involved here would read this chart in particular the last 3 bars Realative to the information on the chart. (1) Is this a test? (2) Why? (3) What do you expect to occur in the future? (4) What would negate your expectation?

By the look of it its around tea time over there. Its Friday morning 10.20 at the hub of efficiency---my desk. Bert I think the charts I posted shows a great example of this. The FIRST up bar shown on very high volume and wide range correlates with bullet point one. The next few bars complete the distribution phase in this timeframe and is typified by the low volume no demand bars. Distribution occurs at the tops of moves and accumulation at the bottoms. The same applies at this end but should be read as the opposite. EG .High volume shows that buying has swamped any selling and tends to appear at the beginning of an accumulation phase. .Low volume shows that there is no selling present and tends to appear at the end of an accumulation phase. Twists the normal mindset doesnt it!

Darren. I'm sure you'll agree that its extremes which create opportunity. While the crowd is madly buying on what "appears" to be massive strength (Wide range enormous volume) we are preparing for opportunity. VSA throws conventional Strength and Weakness theory on its head. The market will be the ultimate judge of our analysis. Our application and management of that analysis will be the ultimate judge of our profitability.

!. Background Weakness, up bars on Low vol - No demand (After a very high volume wide range bar) Up bars on low volume---No demand 2. Background Strength, Down bars on Low Vol - testing for supply (Altered to--Background strength---up bars on low volume AFTER a very high volume wide range down bar,no supply) Subtle but in context.

I'll try to clarify.Some charts to help out below. Any alert given by Tradeguider/VSA analysis is simply an alert.Read in isolation without consideration to the background is folly. It takes a great deal of effort to terminate a trend in either direction. Less to begin a trend.The first chart shows a basic test as determined by tradeguider with the accompanying commentary,You'll notice that the stock rises on below or around average volume,the second chart shows more of the past volume. The last bar has broken out on the lowest volume of the last 3 bars.If this were to represent then "No Demand" we would expect weakness. To chart 2. Here price continues to rise on average volume,until we get to the last bar in the chart where we have a massive volume spike and a wide range.The high volume is indicating Supply and sellers are happy to take all that buyers want. This is the FIRST sign of weakness. This price action must be viewed in context.Moves rarely start and finish with "V" tops and bottoms and we must be alert to these changes. To chart 3 NOW we look for whats occurring in the next bars. Price rises but on low volume indicating lack of DEMAND (After a high volume up bar). Supply continues on the next 2 bars as new highs cannot be held. Once buyers have been exhausted we see price fall off with little to no demand. A test occurs 6 bars from the end of the chart but the next 2 bars confirm no demand. Hope this is helpful.

Will do.I'll post some trade guider charts with Basic test commentary (from Tradeguider). This may help. If the basic test is at the top of a move followed by a low volume up bar then this is a sign of weakness. If the basic test is at the bottom of a move and the next bar is a low volume UP bar this is a sign of strength. Yes and the second component in reading VSA is also available in the range. Clearly the highs could not be held,supportive of your Low volume up bar--indicating an exhaustion of this move in this time frame. The next 2 bars further support the argument for weakness Wide range high volume down day---predictably followed by a weak up move and again now a wide range high volume---almost perfect double bottom. The next bars is a very low volume up bar indicating lack of supply. To early to cal a return to positive trading BUT a low risk entry with a stop below the low if the previous bar makes this a good setup in my view.---worth watching.

TG Yes this is very difficult to get your head around. It flies at 180 degrees with that which we are all educated on. IE Volume = strength/weakness when in actual fact very high volume on very wide range bars means the exact opposite. Bar 8 is a perfect example of no demand. As is the bar 4th from the left. By low volume in the case of the chart being discussed I mean lower than the exhaustion bar as opposed to almost no volume.Note the volume is increasing but not massively,if it did then that would indicate supply coming in a sign of weakness.If we see low volume bars failing to make new highs from here this will also indicate weakness in no demand. It will be the bars immediately following these bars which will complete the picture as will background VSA information not seen on the screen shot.

Firstly("JJ") why wouldn't the trade be managed using VSA rather than a trailing stop (It may not have been you that mentioned this). Tin. Yes correct and as you have said the bar after the initial sell of bar shows new buying. Something to remember and may help is that exhaustion bars whether of buying OR selling need something to exhaust. Either a prolonged bullish or bearish move. This can eliminate guessing for some who could initially mistake the 3rd bar back from the yellow line in your chart as some sort of initial exhaustive move.(Not seeing the whole chart makes this more difficult). Don't know that I agree with this. Low volume and an increase in price can show lack of supply in fact on all 4 bars after your test bar lack of supply has been confirmed. (1) Up bars rise on low volume. (2) The reversal bar has lower volume again and is narrow in body. It often takes a few bars to be able to decipher what volume and Range are clearly saying in a chart.

Tin. If interested I have daily US charts if you want to try some examples on them I can post the Tradeguider charts to help out as examples if you like. Or I could find either realtime ASX charts to demonstrate/discuss or EOD ASX.

Sorry Lack of supply. Have a blood supply problem to brain!

Tingull. Your missing the most important bar. Thats Bar 5 back from the last bar. This is clearly an Exhaustion bar. Wide range massive volume and the NEXT day is an up day indicating exhaustion of supply. The following down days have decreased volume. Your marked bar is confirmation of bar 5 IMPORTANTLY followed by an up day. Id be interested in how this went on as the wide range last bar on low volume is indicating lack of demand. As for the software. I have both EOD and Realtime. 7 bourses Both perform without a glitch. Only ASX equities on realtime.

Things move fast here. The forex question has been answered well by others. Glitches. There is only one glitch with an alert that I'm aware of.While annoying the glitch wont be detrimental to trading. EsignalSeamless integration. Software Firstly I don't think its expensive---everyone has a different view on expensive.I payed for it on my second trade. Using the software and its proprietary tools will bring you up to speed faster than with conventional software and books.You could trade VSA without the software,personally I want all the VSA gizmo's--commentaries in the one place. Backup Frankly since Gavin's take over and as mentioned his marketing bent,I'm of the opinion that his targeting of the Asian market has seen such a tremendous demand that its like grabbing a tiger by the tail. Gavin is a genuine guy with a passion for Tradeguider bought about I believe by the results he has seen and gained personally.Like most businesses which expand at tremendous rates,its a struggle to control everything. Gavin has some enormous challenges,but with the success Tradeguider is enjoying I'm confident that the Business issues will be resolved. Todd left evidently to pursue areas which he couldn't with a connection to Tradeguider,due to confidentiality issues.So they went separate ways. Tingull Just on your chart The 5th bar back is a very important bar. Note the extreme volume AND range.The very next bar is an up bar this indicates thet bar 5 was an absobsion bar from buyers absorbing sellers. One great rule I have found is a bar like this can be identified by the NEXT bar.If selling did indeed hold the trump cards then the next bar would be a down bar.If it was absorbsion then the next would be an up bar. We also need to look at current action relative to past and immediate past action so lets take the 6 bars from the dotted line Gap down to a spinning top on volume the next bar is wide range heavier volume buying,bars 3 and 4 are down on LOWER volume so not much conviction from sellers.Bar 5 has strong buying met by massive supply. Price then drifts down on lightish volume until the tests at the lows. Unfortunately this chart is showing a lack of conviction by buyers,the last bar in the chart is wide range with lower volume---a good thing as supply doesnt seem to be present.The previous setup would have confirmed the test bars as you have pointed out.The low risk entry would have been the hammer you have highlighted. Hope this is of some help. Ill notify both Radge and Gavin of the thread.

Hi from the land down under. Happened to stumble on this thread on VSA and Tradeguider a few days ago. I was predominantly a systems trader for the past 14 yrs and with such a tremendous bull market---success really didny warrant me investigating anything else However as we all see if we look at 1000s of charts,the lure of a quck 10,30,or more % in short term trades has alwaysed had me trying a myriad of methodologies over the years---with mixed results. Introduced to VSA around 9 mths ago and have been trading short term with tradeguider and combining with Elliot Wave analysis for the past 6 mths. I have both EOD and Realtime Tradeguider. Spent a fair amount of time with Gavin Holmes (Director of Tradeguider) during a seminar in Australia reciently. In particular I'm working with him/them on improvements to their search functions.Rather practical use than programming. Anyway the difference in my trading methodology with the introduction in VSA is nothing short of revolutionary---for me anyway.My conventional thinking on Volume and spread has literally been thrown out the door. Results are consistent and rewarding. Its not often you stumble across a serious discussion from fellow traders on a topic you are so passionate about. I'm happy to help out with charts and any questions/discussion on Tradeguider and VSA. I'm not affiliated with tradeguider other than a very happy client,but do know Gavin well enought to ask him to drop by here if you would like any questions directed specifically for him.A very approachable guy with total commitment and passion for his trading and software. Havent read all of the threads but will keep I touch and comment where appropriate. Till then.